VANDERBURGH COUNTY COUNCIL

MINUTES

SEPTEMBER 1, 2004

The Vanderburgh County Council met in session this 1st day of September, 2004 in room 301 of the Civic Center Complex. The meeting was called to order at 3:43 p.m. by County Council President Ed Bassemier.

President Bassemier: I’d like to welcome everyone to the September 1st, 2004 County Council meeting. Attendance roll call please.

President Bassemier: Would everyone please stand for the Pledge of Allegiance?

(Pledge of Allegiance was given)

President Bassemier: Would someone please make a motion for approval of the minutes for August 4, 2004, regular meeting please?

Councilmember Wortman: I make a motion for approval.

Councilmember Raben: I’ll second.

President Bassemier: Got a second. Roll call vote please.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Tornatta?

Councilmember Tornatta: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Sutton?

Councilmember Sutton: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Winnecke?

Councilmember Winnecke: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Hoy?

Councilmember Hoy: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Raben?

Councilmember Raben: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Wortman?

Councilmember Wortman: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: President Bassemier?

President Bassemier: Yes.

(Motion unanimously approved 7-0)

President Bassemier: Now we’ll move into our Appropriation Ordinance and I’ll turn it over to our finance chairman, Mr. Raben.

TREASURER

Councilmember Raben: Okay, thank you, Mr. President. First on the agenda today is the County Treasurer. The request is $700, I’ll move approval.

Councilmember Wortman: Second.

President Bassemier: I have a motion and a second by Mr. Wortman. Any discussion? Roll call vote please.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Tornatta?

Councilmember Tornatta: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Sutton?

Councilmember Sutton: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Winnecke?

Councilmember Winnecke: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Hoy?

Councilmember Hoy: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Raben?

Councilmember Raben: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Wortman?

Councilmember Wortman: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: President Bassemier?

President Bassemier: Yes.

TREASURER                                                         REQUESTED       APPROVED

(Motion unanimously approved 7-0)

SHERIFF

Councilmember Raben: Okay, Mr. President, next under the Sheriff’s office, we have a request in the amount of $24,976. I’m going to move that this be set in at zero and we can have some discussion on this if we need to, but I think there’s probably, time allows us to wait on addressing this issue.

Councilmember Wortman: Second.

President Bassemier: Okay, I have a motion and a second. Any discussion on it?

Councilmember Tornatta: Do we know what kind of time we’re talking about?

Councilmember Raben: Well, you know, I think that the Health Department is scheduled to be out by the end of October. Mr. Hoy is on the board here. And I think that they’re looking at spring before the renovations are complete, so you know, we might have six or seven months yet.

Councilmember Hoy: The soonest the Health Department will move is sometime next month and that has not been laid out yet, it’s in process. I think it will happen next month.

Councilmember Sutton: Is that beginning the move or completing the move?

Councilmember Hoy: No, they’ll do the move. The move has got to be accomplished in a very expeditious way because of the kind of work they handle, so they’re trying to have as much down time as they can. And the new landlord has been very, extremely accommodating in that regard. They’re just trying to get everything, phone lines and all that stuff in place so that the move can go as smoothly as possible. There will be a brief shutdown in certain departments. That’s my information. It could change, but they’re trying to make it as brief as possible. But I’d be surprised if they’re not moved by October. I think that will happen.

Councilmember Tornatta: These individuals would have to go through training and go through all the essential courses that you have to do to become a Deputy, I assume.

Eric Williams: Eric Williams, Chief Deputy Sheriff’s office. Even if you were to approve them today and we were able to bring them on next month, there is a 12 month period for a merit Sheriff’s Deputy to go through the academy and get off probation under the state laws, so if they came on today, a period of time after this court opens, we are going to have to staff it using overtime. We had already planned on that. Now, basically, putting it off just means that period of time is going to increase a little bit. And we’ll do our best to accommodate that. The sooner we can address the issues and get them worked out, the better. But, you know, we understand the dilemmas and we’ll just have to make do with using extra staff from overtime or something to cover that court when it opens. Because it’s 12 months, so if you approve them today, 12 months from now, that place will already have been opened, so...

President Bassemier: Anybody else? Thank you, Eric.

Councilmember Hoy: I have a –

President Bassemier: Roll call vote please.

Councilmember Hoy: Go ahead. No, go ahead. I’ll ask my question later. It’s about another matter that’s related.

President Bassemier: Yes. Roll call vote please.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Tornatta?

Councilmember Tornatta: No.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Sutton?

Councilmember Sutton: I’m going to vote no on this.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Winnecke?

Councilmember Winnecke: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Hoy?

Councilmember Hoy: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Raben?

Councilmember Raben: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Wortman?

Councilmember Wortman: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: President Bassemier?

President Bassemier: Yes.

SHERIFF                                                                REQUESTED       APPROVED

(Table continued next page)

(Motion carried 5-2/Councilmembers Tornatta & Sutton opposed)

President Bassemier: That passes five/two.

JAIL

Councilmember Raben: Thank you. Next, Mr. President, under Jail I’ll move that this be set in at zero.

Councilmember Wortman: Second.

President Bassemier: I have a motion and a second from Mr. Wortman. Any discussion? Roll call vote please.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Tornatta?

Councilmember Tornatta: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Sutton?

Councilmember Sutton: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Winnecke?

Councilmember Winnecke: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Hoy?

Councilmember Hoy: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Raben?

Councilmember Raben: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Wortman?

Councilmember Wortman: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: President Bassemier?

President Bassemier: Yes.

JAIL                                                                       REQUESTED       APPROVED

(Motion unanimously approved 7-0)

President Bassemier: It passes 7/0.

COMMUNITY CORRECTIONS

Councilmember Raben: Okay, next, Mr. President, under Community Corrections we have a request in the amount of $4,113 and I move approval.

Councilmember Wortman: Second.

President Bassemier: I have a motion and a second to approve. Any discussion? Roll call vote please.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Tornatta?

Councilmember Tornatta: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Sutton?

Councilmember Sutton: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Winnecke?

Councilmember Winnecke: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Hoy?

Councilmember Hoy: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Raben?

Councilmember Raben: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Wortman?

Councilmember Wortman: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: President Bassemier?

President Bassemier: Yes.

COMMUNITY CORRECTIONS                              REQUESTED       APPROVED

(Motion unanimously approved 7-0)

SUPERIOR COURT

Councilmember Raben: Okay, Superior Court. We have a request in the amount of $22,640, that’s been withdrawn also. I’ll move that this be set in at zero.

President Bassemier: I have a motion and a second to set it in at zero.

Councilmember Tornatta: It’s been withdrawn.

President Bassemier: Been withdrawn, okay. Any discussion on that? Roll call vote please.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Tornatta?

Councilmember Tornatta: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Sutton?

Councilmember Sutton: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Winnecke?

Councilmember Winnecke: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Hoy?

Councilmember Hoy: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Raben?

Councilmember Raben: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Wortman?

Councilmember Wortman: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: President Bassemier?

President Bassemier: Yes.

SUPERIOR COURT                                               REQUESTED       APPROVED

(Motion unanimously approved 7-0)

SUPERIOR DRUG COURT

Councilmember Raben: Okay, next under Superior Drug Court, we have a request in the amount of $1,306. I’ll move approval.

Councilmember Wortman: Second.

President Bassemier: Have a motion and a second to approve. Any discussion? Roll call vote. I’m sorry, Phil, did you have your hand up? Oh, roll call vote please.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Tornatta?

Councilmember Tornatta: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Sutton?

Councilmember Sutton: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Winnecke?

Councilmember Winnecke: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Hoy?

Councilmember Hoy: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Raben?

Councilmember Raben: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Wortman?

Councilmember Wortman: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: President Bassemier?

President Bassemier: Yes.

SUPERIOR DRUG COURT                                   REQUESTED       APPROVED

(Motion unanimously approved 7-0)

THE CENTRE

Councilmember Raben: Okay, next under The Centre, I’ll move approval in the amount of $140,828.

Councilmember Wortman: Second.

President Bassemier: I have a motion. Who made the second? Mr. Wortman? Any discussion on The Centre? Roll call vote please.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Tornatta?

Councilmember Tornatta: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Sutton?

Councilmember Sutton: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Winnecke?

Councilmember Winnecke: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Hoy?

Councilmember Hoy: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Raben?

Councilmember Raben: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Wortman?

Councilmember Wortman: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: President Bassemier?

President Bassemier: Yes.

THE CENTRE                                                        REQUESTED       APPROVED

(Table continued next page)

(Motion unanimously approved 7-0)

LEGAL AID/UNITED WAY

Councilmember Raben: Okay, that concludes the appropriation requests. Now we have a repeal under United Way in the amount of $1,815, I’ll move approval.

Councilmember Wortman: Second.

President Bassemier: Got a motion and a second. Any discussion? Roll call vote please.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Tornatta?

Councilmember Tornatta: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Sutton?

Councilmember Sutton: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Winnecke?

Councilmember Winnecke: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Hoy?

Councilmember Hoy: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Raben?

Councilmember Raben: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Wortman?

Councilmember Wortman: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: President Bassemier?

President Bassemier: Yes.

LEGAL AID UNITED WAY                                    REQUESTED       APPROVED

(Motion unanimously approved 7-0)

CLERK                                                                   WEIGHTS & MEASURES

SUPERINTENDENT OF CO. BUILDINGS            CIRCUIT COURT

RIVERBOAT                                                          HIGHWAY

AUDITOR (LATE)                                                  JAIL (LATE)

JAIL PROJECT (LATE)

President Bassemier: Transfers.

Councilmember Raben: Okay, Mr. President, under transfers, if no one has any problems with it, I would move that we approve all transfers as listed, and along with that we have three late transfers. One, under County Auditor, line 1020-1130-1020 in the amount of $8,000 to account 1020-1990 in the amount of $8,000. Then under Jail Project, in account 3660-3051 Lodging of Inmates $25,000, transfer be made to account 3660-2240 Medical in the amount of $25,000 and I can explain that one if anyone has any questions on that. Then we have another late transfer under the Jail, which will be account 1051-2200 and that line is the Jail Expense account in the amount of $38,600 to account 1051-2240 Medical. I’ll make all those in the form of a motion.

Councilmember Wortman: Second.

President Bassemier: I have a motion and a second. Any discussion on those?

Councilmember Tornatta: Yeah, I don’t know if I didn’t see this or have a chance to ask this question about all the Extra Help in the Clerk’s office. I didn’t see anything on that, and that’s why I was – I thought I was missing that.

Councilmember Raben: Just people with time off that – I don’t know the exact explanation. The Clerk is here.

Marsha Abell: Which part do you want to know, what we’re taking it out of or we’re moving it in to?

Councilmember Tornatta: No, just the –

President Bassemier: State your name please.

Marsha Abell: I’m sorry, Marsha Abell.

Councilmember Tornatta: $5,800 in the Extra Help.

Marsha Abell: Well, it’s to get us through to the end of the year. We had a person off on medical leave that we didn’t get to replace, we got a rather nasty comment from Circuit Court because we weren’t getting our abstracts done, and I’m shorthanded. I can’t put temporary people in if I don’t have something in my temporary line. If I don’t use it by the end of the year, you can have it back but I don’t want to be stuck like that again.

Councilmember Tornatta: How much money do you normally use in that Extra Help line?

Marsha Abell: Well, the one year I had seven girls pregnant in one year, you know, it’s hard for me to tell you. I didn’t know that we had – (employee name omitted) just got back off six weeks leave for surgery, I’ve got (employee name omitted) off on leave for surgery. The only time I use it is when I’ve got people that are gone because I have to be fully staffed or we don’t get the court’s work done.

Councilmember Tornatta: And is there any Extra Help in – we zeroed Extra Help out of next year’s budget.

Marsha Abell: I have none for next year’s budget or whoever will be the Clerk won’t have any for next year’s budget.

Councilmember Tornatta: Right, so what are they going to do there?

Marsha Abell: I don’t know. It will be a problem because the first six weeks of next year you’ve got two people retiring and they’ll be short those two people, for sure. One of them is the person that does certified mail and we send out 250 pieces of certified mail every day.

Councilmember Raben: Or they’ll do exactly what’s taking place here.

Marsha Abell: They’ll have to come in and hope to –

Councilmember Raben: Funds that have been used out of those individual lines will be transferred –

Marsha Abell: Well, we didn’t get our transfer through last time, which was our fault, but then we didn’t have somebody for the last three weeks that (employee name omitted) was off. Because that department does the abstracts, we didn’t get the abstracts out and Judge Heldt sent a note over and said you’re not getting your abstracts out. Well, you know, when you’ve only got a certain number of people, you can only do a certain amount of work. So I just don’t want us to be stuck. I don’t want to be here in December and have somebody come in and say they’re going to take off the whole month of December for surgery and I don’t have any money to hire somebody to put them in there.

Councilmember Hoy: I would like to ask that the names not be mentioned. I think that medical leave is a personal thing, if you would not do that.

Marsha Abell: That’s fine.

President Bassemier: Anybody else? I have a motion and a second to approve all transfers including the three late transfers. Roll call vote please.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Tornatta?

Councilmember Tornatta: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Sutton?

Councilmember Sutton: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Winnecke?

Councilmember Winnecke: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Hoy?

Councilmember Hoy: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Raben?

Councilmember Raben: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Wortman?

Councilmember Wortman: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: President Bassemier?

President Bassemier: Yes.

CLERK                                                                   REQUESTED       APPROVED

WEIGHTS & MEASURES                                      REQUESTED       APPROVED

SUPERINTENDENT OF CO. BUILDINGS            REQUESTED       APPROVED

CIRCUIT COURT                                                   REQUESTED       APPROVED

RIVERBOAT                                                          REQUESTED       APPROVED

HIGHWAY                                                              REQUESTED       APPROVED

AUDITOR                                                               REQUESTED       APPROVED

JAIL                                                                       REQUESTED       APPROVED

JAIL PROJECT                                                      REQUESTED       APPROVED

(Motion unanimously approved 7-0)

President Bassemier: That passes seven to zero.

Councilmember Raben: Okay, Mr. President, next is the amendments to the Salary Ordinance. I’ll run through these real quick. First is Community Corrections. I move that we amend salary ordinance numbers 1361-1320 Correction Officer, 1361-1350 Correction Officer Supervisor, 1361-1440 Correction Officer as previously adopted. The additional funds, as everyone knows, is for cross training. Superior Drug Court, there is no change in the annual salary, these are just additional funds approved for matching grant purposes. The Centre, amend salary line 1440-1850 Union Overtime as previously adopted. County Clerk, salary line 1010-1440 Bookkeeping Clerk as transfer previously approved. The current employee is a COMOT VI/Step 4, with an annual salary of 31,981. I also move we amend salary line 1010-1990 Extra Help as previously adopted. Then last is Health Department, I move that we amend the salary ordinance to include a line item 2133-1110 Environmental Health Specialist. This is a new Indiana State Department of Health grant. The current employee is to be paid at an initiation rate at $29,155, which is a Step 1, the salary is $30,574. And that’s all we have and, again, that’s my motion.

Councilmember Hoy: Second.

President Bassemier: Got a motion and a second for amendments to the Salary Ordinance. Any discussion on those? Roll call vote please.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Tornatta?

Councilmember Tornatta: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Sutton?

Councilmember Sutton: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Winnecke?

Councilmember Winnecke: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Hoy?

Councilmember Hoy: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Raben?

Councilmember Raben: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Wortman?

Councilmember Wortman: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: President Bassemier?

President Bassemier: Yes.

(Motion unanimously approved 7-0)

Councilmember Raben: Okay, then under well, I’ll let you take care of Old Business first.

President Bassemier: I don’t think we’ve got anything in Old Business. Anybody got anything to bring up in Old Business?

Councilmember Wortman: Mr. Chairman? I’d like to ask a request of Mrs. Deig here, write a letter to the Building Authority requesting that all Councilmembers, the Council Executive Assistant, and the Auditor be furnished with a listing of the breakdown of all county offices and the square footage of these offices. That’s the budget, what they submitted. In addition to the square footage and breakdown, I’d also like to request that the Council be furnished a copy of the Building Authority’s budget. Also, I’d like a listing of all the offices that paid a cable hookup fee and any other charges to the county for this service. I’d like to have that request back by September the 7th, if that’s alright with the Chairman and the Councilmembers.

President Bassemier: That’s alright with me.

Councilmember Wortman: Because I have a problem with this cable TV in these offices.

President Bassemier: Okay, no problem. Anybody got any – want to discuss that a little bit, Royce?

Councilmember Sutton: I was just going to ask, Councilman Wortman, can you give us maybe a little bit more detail on maybe what you’re requesting because I’m not quite sure – what’s the concern here?

Councilmember Wortman: The Building Authority has got a budget and I never have seen it and I’d like to have that request. I’d like to know how they got the cable. Was there a line item in there to hook these cable TV’S in these offices or what, see? How are they paying for it, see, that’s still taxpayer’s money. I’d like to request that.

Councilmember Sutton: How many, just by chance, would you happen to know how many offices have cable TV?

Councilmember Wortman: I don’t, but I want to find out.

President Bassemier: Anybody got a problem with that? It doesn’t hurt to –

Councilmember Hoy: What’s the purpose for the cable hookup? I’m confused, why would you do that?

Councilmember Raben: Could that be part of your request that we get an explanation as to why they need cable TV in offices?

Councilmember Wortman: Yeah, that was the main reason.

Councilmember Raben: That does kind of strike me funny because, you know, if you think about it, there’s a lot of people that are footing the bill to operating county government that can’t afford cable themselves, that don’t have cable, and now we’re taxing them to install cable in offices. So that strikes me funny also.

Councilmember Sutton: I mean, I don’t know, I’m not really aware of what the situation – but I’m wondering if this may in some way be related to maybe the computer hookups, the internet hookups or something like that. I mean, I don’t know.

Councilmember Wortman: For instance, let’s say if they was interested in the weather, you know, they can turn a radio on and the internet, they don’t have to have cable to watch the weather on cable TV, you know what I mean? The next thing, if they get cable in their office and a TV, they’ll be watching soap operas or something, you never know, shut the door. So I want to find those things out –

President Bassemier: I’m sure they’ve got a good reason but it doesn’t hurt to find out why. That’s a good request. So what time do the Cardinals play?

Councilmember Raben: I mean, I don’t know if there’s other department heads here and officeholders –

Councilmember Sutton: Not quite, might want to get a bullhorn.

Councilmember Raben: Well, I mean, does anybody – is it for computer work or is it for cable TV?

Bill Fluty: I don’t have cable.

Sandie Deig: I think all the offices received a memo saying if we wanted to pay a one-time hundred dollar hookup to have cable TV furnished to our office, we could have that. The story that I got, not in the memo, but from the Building Authority was that, when we had 9/11 and when we had the Iraq war, everybody was congregating down by their TV’s, watching it, and maybe we would like to have one in our individual offices. Personally, I didn’t want one.

Councilmember Raben: In the spirit of productivity, that doesn’t make a lot of sense to bring TV’s into an office.

President Bassemier: Eric, you got something you want to say or...

Eric Williams: I guess I’m looking for officeholders and department heads.

Councilmember Sutton: You stand alone.

Eric Williams: I stand alone today as an appointee to an officeholder.

Councilmember Raben: Well, we do actually have an officeholder.

Eric Williams: That’s true. I can speak on behalf of the Sheriff’s office. We’ve been inquiring with the Building Authority for as long as I can remember about getting cable TV into our section of the building. Originally, the goal was to get it for the jail cells because reception is horrible up in the jail for the inmates. We wanted to have a system that would allow us to disallow certain channels, obviously, but to be able to get the local broadcast channels in, because the reception is horrible in this building. That didn’t pan out. We got far enough along in the project for the new jail that we decided that we’re just going to drop that issue and we’ll deal with it in the new jail. The Building Authority then came along to us and said we are running it into the building, would you like it somewhere in your offices? The other reason we’ve always wanted it, as I said, the reception is horrible in this building for both radios and for television, we base a lot of what we do around what the, you know, the media and what’s going on, so we had one run placed into our conference room so that when there’s major breaking news stories when we’re having news conferences or we’re covering something, we can watch the news to see what’s going on. I can assure you from the Sheriff’s standpoint, it’s not going to be used to watch soap operas, MTV or VH1, those kinds of things, it’s to be able to watch the news. That’s our reason and I think we were prepared to take the hundred dollars for our cable run out of our commissary account or some budgeted line item, but you know, if somebody tells us they don’t think that’s an appropriate use, then so be it. But we felt that being able to watch the news and especially the local broadcast since they’re carried on local cable TV, that that was a valid use of the resource.

Councilmember Sutton: That sounds very plausible, I mean, especially offices that deal with emergencies and you need to know certain things that relate to broadcasts or with storms or other issues that may arise like Emergency Management –

President Bassemier: I’ll agree with you.

Councilmember Sutton: -- Sheriff’s department, possibly maybe the Health department, but the others it would be interesting to see what information we get back in terms of their rationale and how many offices actually do have it. But outside of maybe emergency purposes, I’ll just wait to see what we get back.

President Bassemier: That’s a good point, Curt, I’m glad you brought that. I’ll be curious to...

Councilmember Tornatta: I was just going to say, I’d just like to make a comment just to kind of put a closure from the Council side, and I think maybe it needs to be on the record, maybe it’s understood, but we have had an issue on people, maybe officeholders thinking that they can sell stuff in order to maybe get monies back into their office. And just to put it on the record that nothing is for sale in this building without going through the proper channels and then those monies cannot go back to your office just because you sell something out of it. So I think maybe that got, we were talking about computers at one point and maybe that got construed with how things were going to progress, but I mean, obviously, they can pick up the minutes and read that. Won’t be any officeholders here, but I think that’s something that we need to at least have on the record so if we need to go back and explain to people how the system works, we can.

President Bassemier: Phil?

Councilmember Hoy: My comment is that I can see where perhaps someone in, like the Sheriff’s office, might need access to that, but as a person who has run a large operation, I sure would not be piping cable in, you know, for that reason. I mean, somebody in charge needs to know what’s going on but we don’t need the public thinking that people are sitting around watching cable TV in this building, and I don’t think they should be, and I think we need to look into it. That’s my feeling. I think Mr. Wortman’s suggestion is a good one, let’s see where and what’s going on. I would, if I walked into an office and I saw somebody watching cable TV, I’d be pretty upset as a Councilman, as a taxpayer, as a citizen.

President Bassemier: Troy, I think what you was trying to say on computers, or selling anything if we’re going that way, I’d just like to say I hate to see anything given away without first trying to sell it for whatever value it is. I mean, I know we’ve been reading a lot here lately about the Commissioners on the computers in the Clerk’s office, but anything, I think, it ought to be put up for surplus and we ought to try to get whatever we can out of it. Of course, giving it to people in other departments or the Civic Center, if they can use it, but I just can’t see giving things away without trying to put it up for surplus first.

Councilmember Tornatta: If I’m not mistaken, we had a meeting that we discussed that and we opted to be able to donate those computers to those places who needed them, any of those parts or whatever. So I thought that was handled at that point and we were doing a good – I say a good service, sometimes, because I really don’t think those computers were much. It was for somebody that was going to use it in the most basic of ways. It was not going to be anything that could be used in a – like you normally use a computer because I’ve actually talked to some of the people that have gotten those computers and they were grateful they got them but they had to combine two or three to make one halfway decent one. So it was probably something that might have cost us more to get rid of than it was to donate. And so I mean, I thought that was a moot point, but I didn’t think selling those computers was going to be, and I definitely knew that if we sold them, it was not going to go back to the office no matter what office, those monies were not just going to go back to that office.

President Bassemier: Well, I just thought that just opens the door. You was using computers as an example, but it could be anything. Like the Police department, they auction off different stuff they confiscate or whatever, anything that’s – you know, I just don’t think that we should just give things away without –

Councilmember Hoy: Mr. President, for the record so it’s in the minutes, I was a person who asked for computers for a charity, specifically the Youth Service Bureau. I called Mr. Halbrook, the Youth Service Bureau did receive 18 computers and they are using them. They are using them in the Healthy Families Program, and whatever else is going on about the computers, that’s what I wanted to check out because that was my connection with a specific charity and they did get the computers. And we do fund some things, you know, as a Council, in connection with that office and so I don’t have any problems with that at all. If that’s the case with – you know, I think that needs to be checked out but, so far, I’m happy with what I arranged.

Councilmember Wortman: Mr. President, in years past they always had an auction, all surplus property, and then they bid on it. What was left over, they could give away. That’s always been the practice for years.

President Bassemier: Yeah, that’s what I thought. It would go out first, and then if nobody would buy it – that would be cleaner, I would think. And I use the computers as an example, but –

Councilmember Wortman: For instance, like the furniture down there, that’s not the Building Authority’s property, that’s the county’s property. But the Commissioners can authorize it, I guess, you know, from that standpoint. But still, like desks and all, see, that’s the county’s property.

President Bassemier: Thank you, Curt. Jim?

Councilmember Raben: I was never going to allow myself to become part of this argument but there is a few valid points that need to be addressed here. One is, you know, I think it had been discussed in this room about the possibility of upgrading the better equipment that may be removed from offices. I still think that that’s a strong possibility. And, you know, we do it with our computers at home and we do it with computers, you know, at the places we work. And I still think we need to further look into making upgrades to some of that equipment. But I don’t necessarily have a problem with giving it to worthy charities. You know, I think they -- from an educational standpoint, it’s great and there is a lot of organizations that need them, but I do think they should go through a public meeting. I don’t think anything should be donated that’s not addressed through a public meeting. Now whether that did or didn’t happen, I don’t even know. But I assume that it did happen in a public meeting, I don’t know.

Councilmember Sutton: Well, I know there was a discussion here about those computers and what would happen to them and I know I had a discussion with County Clerk, Marsha Abell, about some of those computers going over to a program, after school program, over at the C. K. Newsome Center. We both felt pretty strongly that that was a good organization that could benefit from them and they did actually get some of those units. But I think what’s been said earlier by several of you, you know, all the property, furniture and fixtures are acquired by the county and it’s the county’s property. So at some point in time when it says expired in its useful life, you can either put it on the salvage heap or try to go ahead and have a surplus sale. So I think, as we all know, because of the rate in which technology is going, you know, a computer that is four years old is pretty antiquated these days so it can’t handle the processors and the software that goes along with some of the computers. So when you’re talking about a six year old unit, it’s a good thing if we can get those into the hands of people who don’t necessarily need to have the latest and greatest tools when it comes to technology. But probably the market for those units is – there’s probably not much really value there if we were to have some type of sale, we’d probably find ourselves with a whole lot of units kind of sitting there. So I don’t know if it’s really a matter where, at this point in time, whether the Council can do much or add much value to – other than just reiterating that it’s our body that handles from the financial end, as far as acquiring the furniture and fixtures around here. So that’s about all we can really add.

Councilmember Hoy: We probably need to frame a resolution to send to wherever it needs to go declaring that computers are no longer under the category of durable goods since they only last about a year.

Councilmember Tornatta: I mean there could be some good will, I think the county can have a good will presentation because people pay taxes, they want to know what they get back. This is an opportunity to give back to some of the charitable organizations and we’re really giving it back to kids because all these organizations that I’ve talked to were on a waiting list. That waiting list was handled in an order of how it was taken, and those computers were doled out and really thought it was professional how they did it. I didn’t know they had such a list, but they had that list and they doled those out and, you know, I think it’s a good opportunity to give back to the community.

President Bassemier: But I was just going to say a final thing, I still think it ought to be turned over to surplus because you just can’t pick and choose. And after, because we are looking out for the taxpayer’s money, they first bought the computers, we bought them with taxpayer’s dollars and if we can get anything out of it, then what we don’t get out of, then I have no problem with that. But I don’t think we can just pick and choose what we’re going to donate and what we don’t. I think it ought to go through the processes.

Councilmember Tornatta: Mr. President, those were surplussed.

President Bassemier: Okay, well, if they were put on the auction and nobody bought them or whatever, that’s fine. I have no problem with that. But if they wasn’t and somebody said we can get a hundred dollars a piece of out them, I think that’s wrong just to give them away. I know they’re going to good places but moving on –

Councilmember Hoy: Mr. President, I don’t know whether this is old or new, but the other thing I wanted on record is I read in the newspaper this morning that the Building Authority is going to install the TV equipment and pay the $20,000 for broadcasting Commissioner’s meetings. My understanding is that that’s not a gift, that’s a loan. And that bothers me if that’s just a loan because I need to have clarity on that, because if it’s just a loan, then I don’t know that we should be obligated for something that this body has not voted to fund. The second question I have is, the 2.3 million for renovating the old Health department section which started out at 1.8 million, now it’s up to 2.3, is that a loan or is the Building Authority paying for that out of their own funds? I don’t know the answer to that, but I’d like to know because –

Councilmember Raben: That’s our – that’s being paid for out of our debt service. That’s money that would have otherwise, now I don’t know what it’s going to be with the 2.3, do you, Bill? But I know when the figure was the 1.5 or 1.8, that was going to be with the money that we have coming back to us when they terminate the bonds officially on this facility.

President Bassemier: Don’t you think we ought to call Mr. Rector in and let him clarify what he’s saying? I don’t fully understand, I was just reading in the newspaper –

Councilmember Hoy: It’s $230 a square foot.

President Bassemier: Yeah, just let him, you guys got a problem with that because he’s made a statement in the paper that he’s going to –

Councilmember Raben: Again, the renovation was actually the county’s reserve, would come back to us had we not renovated the space. And I will tell you I was in a meeting in part of that discussion –

President Bassemier: Well, I was, too, but it’s changed.

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