COUNCILMEMBER	PRESENT	ABSENT
Councilmember Tornatta	X
Councilmember Sutton	X
Councilmember Abell	X
Councilmember Goebel	X
Councilmember Raben	X
Councilmember Wortman	X
President Winnecke	X

President Winnecke: Would you please stand and join me in the Pledge of Allegiance?

President Winnecke: Okay, before we get to the official business at hand, I think it would be appropriate to recognize one of our colleagues who became the winningest wrestling coach in the state of Indiana history, congratulations to Mr. Goebel and the Mater Dei Wildcats! Great victory for the school and for our community. Mr. Wortman?

President Winnecke: I also have another bit of good news. I hold in my hands two checks: one from Deaconess Hospital and the one from the St. Mary’s Medical Center, each in the amount of $140,000, which will be given to the County Auditor for deposit at the end of this meeting. These checks represent grant funds for the dental clinic. So this dental clinic will go forward. If you’ll recall, we appropriated $80,000 from the county’s standpoint, so we have $360,000 to start this dental clinic. Mr. Heck tells me that they’re in the process of taking applications for a dentist and some other positions. They have quotes on equipment, so things are moving merrily along. So I appreciate everyone’s work on that and a special public thank you to Deaconess and St. Mary’s for their participation in a great public/private partnership. Mr. Fluty, I will entrust those to you. One other piece of business, you have before you a purple form. Teri, you may correct me if I get off track here, but the county really needs a record of this from each county employee. This is really for the Councilmembers and Mrs. Deig and Mrs. Nunn. Please make sure you complete the appropriate paperwork and return it to Teri so they have this on record in the Auditor’s office. Okay, now we’ll get –

President Winnecke: At this time I will consider, we need to approve the minutes from our February 1st meeting.

President Winnecke: Also, we need to consider the minutes from our special meeting of January 25th. If you’ll recall, that’s the meeting where we had considered the tax phase-in for Shoe Carnival.

President Winnecke: Okay, now we’ll begin with the appropriation ordinance and I’ll turn the floor over to Mr. Raben, the finance chair. And just a reminder for those watching at home, we did hear the requests last week at our meeting. If we don’t ask questions, I assume that the Councilmembers each have the information that they need to make the vote that they cast here today. So, Mr. Raben, with that caveat, you may begin.

Councilmember Raben: Okay, thank you, Mr. President. First on the agenda is Jail 1051-1850 Union Overtime, move that be set in at $30,000.

Councilmember Wortman: Would the representative from the Sheriff’s department come forward, please?

Councilmember Wortman: Thank you. The Union Overtime, last month you requested $100,000, you got 25,000, and now its 75,000 and they made a motion for 30,000, is this going to continue or why, can you tell me why this overtime is so much? You know, it started out, in the Jail you didn’t need any help, and then we got 34 people. And it just seems like there’s no end to this thing. Can you explain why all this overtime, without excuses?

Eric Williams: Well, I won’t make excuses for it. I’m actually very proud of the way our department handles our overtime. We treat it as a valuable resource that allows us to perform the jobs that we perform. There are some factors and variables that go into the overtime that forces it to fluctuate sometimes. And one of the key factors with the Union Overtime in the Jail has been the transition. There have been a lot of hours spent getting the transition ready and doing those kind of things and preparing for that. Now we mentioned, you mentioned the 34 new employees and that is true, we were granted those last year and bringing on to the budget, but as you’ll remember, that money was kind of phased in last year and towards the end of the year, because of the budget unknowns, we were asked by Council not to hire any of those people until after the state approved the budget. So that put us way back in a holding pattern back into almost October and November before we could even start the hiring process. So that left us shorter of people that we needed to actually bring this place on line. One of the other variables or factors that goes into it is that those people are all governed by a union contract. And the contract allows them to choose whether or not they receive compensatory time or overtime. And just to give you kind of an example of how that impacts us, in 2004, we had 14 employees that were choosing overtime as opposed to compensatory time. In 2005, there were 23, almost a hundred percent increase or doubled, which that’s a choice they make by the contract. And then in 2006, we’re up to 36 people that are now choosing the overtime pay as opposed to compensatory time. You know, those numbers, when you start to look at that, when you just factor in the holiday time that you pay, that’s a pretty big sum of money. So I think those are some of the key variables that go into this. Now, part of your question was, is this an ongoing thing, is it ever going to get better? We’d like to think it is and as things begin to settle out and we get a better control of it, we get all of our people on board, everything flat lines itself out, there will always be a need for overtime. As long as the contract is worded the way it is, for holidays, you’ll have some overtime. There is some overtime that’s necessary for handling emergencies, training, and those kinds of things. Yes, we do believe it will level out and we met with Councilman Raben and Councilman Winnecke, and went through in great depth and detail as to how these are all formulated and, as you can see, Councilman Raben set our request in at substantially smaller than what we thought we could get by with. And we’re going to continue to do our best to make that last.

Councilmember Wortman: Yeah, they tell me the commodes are being stopped up. Is that true?

Eric Williams: That is correct. We’ve had some issues with the plumbing. The contractor has been out there on several occasions trying to correct a design in the plumbing. I don’t know that much about plumbing so I can’t answer specifically what it is. But they’ve been out there on a regular basis and most of those problems are starting to correct themselves. I’m fairly comfortable with all the equipment, FF & E type items that are in that building, but they’re all starting to level out and get working. Its just, I don’t think it would be realistic to expect that everything work perfectly that day that place opened.

Councilmember Wortman: Well, I’m aware of that. What’s the, you had mentioned overtime, so are we talking about everything settling down? Is the jail full now or half full or –

Eric Williams: Actually, today, we were rated at 512 housing beds, if you count our booking, medical and the other beds, its 544. Today’s census, if I remember correctly, was about 460. So, you know, we’ve got 40, 60, 70 some-odd beds unoccupied right now, so we’re not full. I had notified the Council some time ago that within two weeks of opening, we had retracted every inmate that was outside in an outside county and gotten them back into our facility. Community Corrections is running at capacity. There are 200 beds there and there’s routinely 199-200 people in those beds.

Councilmember Wortman: How are we doing on the courts back and forth? Are they doing video, are the attorneys requesting they come to court or how is that, when you’re transferring, do you –

Eric Williams: So far we haven’t, nobody’s – we haven’t lost anybody and everybody’s gotten to court and where they were supposed to be. We’re moving everybody physically right now and not using video arraignment. We’re still awaiting some final modifications to one of the court rooms they’re remodeling down there and once that’s on line, I think everybody is ready to give that a try. And we suspect by our statistics that that will reduce the number of people we transport initially by 30 to 40 percent, which may not sound like a huge number, but when you’re transporting 70 to 80 a day, 30 to 40 percent is a sizable number and not to mention, just a savings in security risk of moving inmates.

President Winnecke: Other questions? Okay, we have a motion and a second. Roll call vote please.

Councilmember Raben: Community Corrections? Okay, move down to Community Corrections, 1361-1850 Overtime in the amount of $25,000, 1361-1330-1361 and 1361-1440-1361 as listed, for a total of $30,525. I’ll move approval.

President Winnecke: There’s a motion and a second. Questions or discussion on these items? Mr. Sutton?

Councilmember Sutton: Let me make sure I’m clear, Chief Deputy Williams, regarding the overtime here. Is this what we anticipate it to be or is it what we already owe on this overtime, was it already accumulated?

Councilmember Sutton: Okay. And as you have kind of calculated these numbers, what did you use to kind of factor in? How did you get to that number?

Eric Williams: Well, a lot of it is just educated guess, working with what we’ve been doing, looking at how the system is beginning to settle in, looking at the time line on getting all of our vacant positions filled, looking at our training calendars and all the other things that go on that require the use of overtime. Now obviously, there’s no way to predict unusual circumstances or things that come up, but you know, right now we’re hopeful and we’re going to be as hopeful as anybody that this is going to get us by. And I’d be the first to tell you, though, that we may come back. We may have to come back and ask for more. There is no way to actually predict all that. A huge chunk of our overtime goes towards just funding the overtime pay for holidays. So that’s pretty easy to calculate.

Councilmember Sutton: Over the next two or three months we’ve got...I can think of a couple of holidays.

Eric Williams: Well, over the course of the year. This was to get us through the year.

Eric Williams: One of the other dynamics is that, you know, generally, the overtime money runs out towards the very end of the year so our first payroll in January is paying off all the holidays usually from Thanksgiving forward and all the overtime accrued during the holiday season, which usually takes a pretty big lump out of the budgeted money for the first of the year to pay off the end of the year debt.

Councilmember Sutton: Okay, I got you. I didn’t realize you were looking for the full year. I mean, if we’re looking at the full year – I mean, clearly, as we begin to see some trends as things develop, I mean, we’ll get a better idea of what that balance, what that mix might be. So, I guess, just trying to get that in relation to even the previous request, too, as just kind of what you are seeing. So that will give us a better idea as we move along. Just keep us posted and, of course, I know you will.

Eric Williams: We’re actually, you know, the Kronos system that the county put in has some weaknesses in its ability to report and we’ve been working with Kronos in the last week trying to get some additional information that would allow you to be able to trend some of this a little better and look at where the money is going in specific categories as opposed to just generalities. And that’s something, once available to us, we’d be glad to share, just so you can see it.

Councilmember Sutton: Well, I know Councilman Wortman obviously had several questions, we’re just trying to, I guess in just thinking about just the ways that we can be as efficient as possible and just be ahead of the curve of anticipated costs. And so, yeah, if you can share the information with us, that will be extremely helpful for us.

Councilmember Abell: I’ll just, Mr. Raben, would you read those numbers again please?

Councilmember Raben: I certainly can, 25,000 on the Overtime, the other two amounts as they are listed, for a total of $30,525.

Eric Williams: The only other thing while I happen to be up here, I would like to mention, and I don’t want to catch anybody off guard, next month we’ll be up asking for overtime money in our deputy account next month. One of the issues that we have there is that we had some major expenditures out of that account, primarily the tornado, that cost about $46,000 in overtime from last year’s account that caused it to run short and then carry over in the same thing, the first of the year paid off substantial overtime left over from last year. So I just wanted to let you know that we’ll be here this next month for the same thing.

Eric Williams: Yeah, that’s a question only the Sheriff can answer himself, but I will tell you that the Commissary is being spent very heavily right now in the new facility. If you’ll remember, we had pledged a half a million dollars out of the accrued account there and that’s all been spent towards the new facility and we’ve spent another hundred thousand dollars on buying supplies and equipment and things necessary for that new jail to avoid having to come back here and ask for those now.

Councilmember Wortman: Can you give me a balance, or the Council here, I guess, not me, for next month?

Eric Williams: I can tell you right now the current balance in the Commissary account is about $64,000. But yeah, we’ll – I can give you the monthly report if you’d like it.

Councilmember Goebel: I don’t know, does FEMA money factor in on any of this, your overtime?

Eric Williams: We hope that we will get a reimbursement. We’ve applied for those reimbursements and that money then, if we get it, and there’s no reason to believe we won’t, would then come back to the County’s general fund. But that doesn’t come back to us, specifically, to our knowledge.

Councilmember Goebel: Will we be able to find that out before the next meeting? I know this is the topic today, but...

Eric Williams: We can try to find out but that’s sometimes a little more difficult to find out when they’re going to fund or when they’re going to make those decisions. Now I do know that one of the volunteer fire departments has received some of their reimbursements as recently as this week.

President Winnecke: I’ll be happy to check with the Commissioners to see when they anticipate county reimbursement. I’ve not heard of a date, but I’ll check on that.

Councilmember Sutton: How much, Auditor Fluty, do we have in the Jail account, do you know by chance?

Councilmember Sutton: Right, we did spend some, but surely there should still be a healthy balance so, I mean, we obviously aren’t seeing any large things that come through related to the new jail. But something that we want to keep in mind. If we need to, that’s always a source that we can dip into. And I think the agreement that we did have, as Chief Deputy indicated about that Commissary fund that the commitment amount that they would provide to us that we would not try to go back and hit that again since they were pledging a pretty hefty amount from that Commissary amount. So that jail fund might be a possibility for us.

Eric Williams: One last thing. Having been in operation now for a period of time, I do invite the entire Council to come out and see the facility in operation, take a tour of it and see what it looks like now that its filled and housed and we’re working and it may give you a better understanding of what goes on day to day in that facility. You’re welcome to come out either as a group or individually, please don’t hesitate. We’d like to show it off.

Councilmember Raben: Okay next, Mr. President, is County Assessor 1090-1120-1090 Chief Deputy. I’m going to move that that be set in at $928, FICA 1090-1900 at 71, 1090-1910 PERF $56, for a total of $1,055. And what this reflects is taking into consideration the Chief Deputy’s Level II Certification where they earn a $500 stipend. This will make them consistent with the other Chief Deputies. And along, since we’re on this item, we need to probably address in April the same situation, if you remember, with the Surveyor’s office. They were in late last year requesting this. So –

Councilmember Tornatta: Would that be the only other office that we’d need to address?

President Winnecke: Any other questions or discussion? Oh, I need a second please.

President Winnecke: We have a motion and a second. Now, questions or discussion. Roll call vote please.

Councilmember Raben: Okay, next Election Office, 1210-3530 Contractual in the amount of $10,000, I’ll move approval.

Councilmember Goebel: Last meeting I believe it was brought up, is this part of the Commissioner’s budget or has that been clarified?

Councilmember Tornatta: Now this was transportation of the – this was actually physically moving the equipment from the storage site to polling places or to the Civic Center, rather.

Councilmember Sutton: I mean what’s to keep us from having a request from the Commissioners?

Councilmember Sutton: Well, but this request is coming from the Election Office. I mean, what’s to keep the Commissioner’s Office from – well, from one of their line items, surely, they could find a way to pay for this. Silence fell over the room.

Councilmember Raben: Yeah, I don’t have an answer for that. I don’t know what funds they have to pull from.

Councilmember Sutton: Well, and I guess my point is, you know, here we are early in the year, January and February, and I know what it’s like for us when it comes September, October and November how tight it is. So we protect our dollars and our dimes now and lessen some of the impact that we have later on in the year. I mean, if the Commissioners have the ability to pull this out of their budget, I mean, and since they’ve traditionally -- and what ultimately happens is we pay for this now, this election office budget, that’s what its going to continuously be pulled out of there rather than where it needs to be.

President Winnecke: But just for the sake of discussion, does it matter if it comes – if the Election Office overseas the delivery or the Commissioners?

Councilmember Sutton: Well, I’m not talking about overseeing the delivery. I mean, I guess I’m talking about the actual, the payment.

President Winnecke: Right. But, I mean, at the end of the day it really doesn’t matter as long as one of those two entities pays for it, correct?

Councilmember Sutton: But if they’ve got money in their budget now, that’s different than money that we’re pulling from the unappropriated balance, which is what their request is here.

Councilmember Abell: Mr. Fluty, are there any monies left in the HAVA funds because I know this could be used for this.

Councilmember Abell: Well, I know that it was put into the Commissioner’s budget because the Commissioners approached me when I was in charge of the Election Office and said you can’t enter into a contract, this is a contractual thing, and we’re going to put it in our budget. And that’s why they moved it. I don’t know where it necessarily belongs, financially, but it is a function of the Election Office to get the things delivered.

Councilmember Raben: When did that take effect? Because its my understanding that it was not budgeted for 2006. I mean, are you talking two - three years, four years?

Councilmember Abell: I’m going back to when I was the Clerk and the Commissioners were a different group of Commissioners.

Councilmember Raben: But it was not budgeted in the Commissioners budget for `06?

Councilmember Goebel: If the Commissioners do have funding for this then we could maybe not take it out of the General fund, how long of a time period do we need prior to the actual setting of the machines, how much advance do they need as far as the funding of it? Can we wait a month, is my question.

President Winnecke: Probably Mrs. Abell or the Auditor would be best able to answer that.

Councilmember Abell: You’re tight right now. Does anybody know, has the Clerk said anything about sending out requests for bids on this or anything?

Bill Fluty: As soon as they get the money in place they were going to go out for bids. So its kind of hinging on today’s decision.

Councilmember Abell: Yeah, its tough, tight on time because they’ve got to get the bids back and then award the contract. And there’s a possibility no one will want this and then you’re going to have a real problem trying to find somebody to deliver those things.

President Winnecke: Perhaps the issue is, maybe a resolution is we approve this today, we can check to see if there’s $10,000 in their budget. I don’t recall that it was. If it is, we’ll encourage the Commissioners to transfer that back to the General fund. We could do that.

Councilmember Goebel: Okay, I don’t think we want to impede the process at all, so that sounds very reasonable.

Councilmember Tornatta: If the Commissioners could approve it out of their budget that would be immediate monies, correct?

Councilmember Tornatta: So, I mean, he or she could go out, the Clerk could go out for bids next Tuesday afternoon or next Wednesday as far as that’s concerned if we want to use it out of one of their budget line items.

President Winnecke: I’m fine with approving the request as it is and encouraging, checking to see if it is and then encouraging the Commissioners to transfer that amount back to the General fund if they have it in their budget.

Councilmember Tornatta: Because that happens a lot. I mean, once the – you know, as Mr. Ahlers says, the toothpaste is out of the tube, it’s hard to get it back in. And in this case, I mean, I think that if we want the Commissioners to pull it out of their budget, then if we appropriate this, the chances are less likely that its going to come back to us.

Councilmember Raben: Mr. President? Maybe we could do this, maybe we could come back to this if, possibly, Sandie, if you wouldn’t mind stepping next door and telling them what we’re up against, ask them if there’s an account that they can pull this from. We’ll address it before we adjourn. How’s that?

Councilmember Raben: Do I need to suspend my motion or what do I need to do here?

Councilmember Wortman: Yeah, normally, the procedure has always been in the past you get the money before the bids are let out to make sure the money is there.

Councilmember Raben: Okay, I’m going to move on and we’ll come back to that.

Councilmember Raben: Next under County Council 1480-3860 Contractual Computers, I think there was a presentation given last week on this $450,000 request. Mr. President, I’m going to move at this time that this be set in at zero pending the finalization of the budget and our unappropriated balance.

President Winnecke: There is a motion and a second. I’m sure there will be some discussion on this. I know that Mrs. Abell has actually some pretty good points relating to possibly approving or considering a piece of this that might help expedite a couple of issues. Would you like to address that?

Councilmember Abell: Possibly, Mr. VanCleave, you can come to the microphone and we can do this in a joint venture, maybe. One of the items involved in replacement of the computers in the Courts package, which is what this is for, was eleven of those computers were going to be taken out of service and taken into the Election Office. If we don’t approve new computers for the courts right now, then we’re going to have to put eleven new ones in the Election Office, is my assumption. Is that correct?

Councilmember Abell: Well, you won’t have eleven to move over to the Election Office if you don’t have – you can’t replace eleven in the courts if you don’t have eleven to move to the Election Office, is that correct?

Councilmember Abell: See, that’s going to be a concern. I don’t particularly want to put eleven brand new computers in an office that runs twelve weeks out of the year.

Councilmember Raben: What we can do, there is a Contractual account within our budget now. We could spend from it. You know, that will make it short for the balance of the year and we can reappropriate monies to replace for those eleven next month, if we’d like. But there are funds if we need to do that, they can use today.

Councilmember Abell: Okay, Tim, let me ask you, can we divide up the computers and the printers, because I think the printers seems to be a bigger issue with this Council than computers?

Tim VanCleave: Where there is a desire, we can always create a plan to accommodate.

Councilmember Sutton: Let me make sure I’m clear here regarding the computers that you’re talking about, Councilman Abell. When are they needing these units?

Councilmember Sutton: In the Election Office, yeah. And they’re using those for election purposes?

Councilmember Sutton: Well, I guess if that is the case from a timing standpoint, if we’re looking at this request that we have before us and even though we have zeroed this out, by the time that they would prepare all of what they need to do regarding an RFP and getting the bids in, if we were to approve this today, but we’re not, they wouldn’t make the timetable that you’re looking for on the Election Office if I’m kind of understanding just timing-wise all of what you guys need to do and what they need in the Election Office. I mean, to transfer those eleven units over, you couldn’t just snatch those units out of wherever they’re going to be and put them in the Election Office and think that in the amount of time that you could then go ahead and get all the process that needs to be cleared away to get those eleven units back on line in the other location, am I correct?

Tim VanCleave: Not having thought through that concept, it’s a little difficult to answer straightforward on that. There would be the opportunity that there are some areas that if we knew that the replacement computers were funded and we were moving forward, that we might be able to shift the necessary equipment up into the Election Office for the upcoming couple of months knowing that they would be replaced shortly after that. The other side of this becomes back into the repair issue which all this equipment is now out of warranty, so any units that are not fully utilized now are going to have to be utilized to keep the court ready to function, whereas some of those units could be allocated up into the Election Office now to handle the upcoming employees that will be increasing over the next few weeks in preparation for the primary election. Does that answer your question? Its kind of –

Tim VanCleave: Using a collection phrase, we’re robbing Peter to pay Paul, and then we’ll get from Paul to give back to Peter here, as quickly as we can.

Councilmember Sutton: Well, one of the things I know I had specifically requested last week and we were looking at some type of format and got the proposal yesterday afternoon from your office regarding this particular request we’re looking at, this is a little difficult for us to follow. Let me speak for myself, difficult for me to follow. I don’t know about the rest of the Councilmembers, perhaps maybe you understand this very clearly, but there is a lot of information in here. I guess what I’m really trying to get my arms around understanding is, if we are, one of the things I mentioned is this phasing process of trying to bring the units on and we kind of mentioned some of the pros and cons of that, but just trying to get an idea if we were to replace say a third of them this year, a third next year and I don’t really see that here in the proposal, now I guess what this proposal here shares with us is just the total amount of purchase down to the equipment, software, hardware, and where they would be located and the types of things that we are looking at, but help me through this proposal here to read this the way you understand it so that we can understand in kind of layman’s terms relative to the higher needs on the units that you’re hoping to replace down to the lower priorities, and what those numbers are. And I know we are at some point in time, going to readdress this issue, we’ve zeroed it out today, we’re going to readdress this, but help me, give me a high level executive summary of what you’ve tried to put together here for us.

Tim VanCleave: The high level summary is that the idea is to stretch the costs. If my estimations are correct, the county is going to spend somewhere between the one million to 1.3 million dollars over a three year period because this hardware is going to need to be replaced. Whether you replace that a third this year, a third in the following year and then a third in that sequential year, you’re going to spend that amount of money over time. The challenge has always been when you come out and want to try to accomplish something like that you have equipment that is growing older, which means failures. So you are increasing your maintenance costs for the equipment. So the general idea is that if we were doing that today, we would have computers in service that would be approaching six years old by the time we ended that cycle, in which case we will have a significant portion of those computers or workstations and printers that will be increasing the maintenance cost to the county. What we are able to do by coming in all at one time is to present a bulk purchase that a lot of the vendors that already have state quantity purchase agreements, or better known as the QPA’s, they may be willing to offer a zero percent financing agreement, which gives us the benefit of spreading the cost over a three year period just as the phase process would accomplish, but we get all of the equipment up front, which then helps eliminate that additional maintenance cost that would occur on the five and six year old equipment over the next three years, because those computers would be under a warranty and we would not have to pay for the normal failures, such as if a hard drive failed, a video card failed, the warranty covers those. I’ve checked on some of the HP printers and they can also be placed under a three year, next day replacement, so that if the printer fails, they would just bring in a new printer within a day to two days and bring that office back up and functioning. So these are some of the advantages. We get the goal of the phase-in process, which is spreading the cost over three years at zero percent financing, but we also eliminate the issue of non-warranty expenses by getting all new hardware here at the present.

Councilmember Sutton: The other question, that helps, the other question was in relation to how you and Matt, I see Matt back there, are working together or discussions that you had in relation to just the total package of technology needs that we have for the county, where have those discussions gone?

Tim VanCleave: I was leaving those discussions primarily with the elected officials. We did have a meeting with Matt last summer in preparation for this. We had a brief meeting with Matt and the Judge and myself, sometime between Thanksgiving and Christmas, I don’t remember the actual details. We were trying to get the funding in place first and then bring in the resources after that to begin the contractual work. Once again, we assumed that that was the appropriate procedure. I did not involve Matt heavily in this process knowing that he was busy and I know that there are other issues going on. So I was trying to keep the work on this as apolitical as possible because I didn’t want to shadow any of the other efforts going on that do not relate specifically with the court’s operations. I don’t know if that answers the question or – that was the basic feelings and working forward. But if you want this to be shared with that individual prior to, you know, that would be up to the Judge and the Clerk and the Prosecutor’s office. And the Judge is here today to address that. Basically under my contractual terms I am here to serve the court and I take my direction from the Judges as well as trying to make sure that I work within the enterprise direction. And while I haven’t been on a day to day conversation with Matt, I do through my superior, Joe Anslinger, a weekly status as I told the board last week. I have kept it very simple knowing that there is a lot going on.

President Winnecke: We’re going to change the tape. It seems like an appropriate time.

Councilmember Tornatta: Mr. Van Cleave, just kind of curious on a couple of things. One of them is the eleven computers that we need in the Election Office, where were the computers before? Did they go to another office? Just kind of concerned. Ms. Abell, you might have a better idea –

Councilmember Tornatta: Well, I mean, where there eleven and then, I don’t know, maybe why or if they were in a budget for 2006 or were they thrown out or – just trying to get an idea.

Councilmember Abell: I’m not sure that the Clerk knew she was going to need new ones. They put in a new voter registration system and for the Election Office to be able to pull up the records that they have to have for sending out absentee ballots and doing everything, the computers that they have won’t work. They’ve got to have – I mean, the company came in here that put in the new voter registration system and said it won’t cost the county anything. Well, it didn’t in the Voter Registration Office, but its going to in the Election office and I don’t think that the current Clerk knew she was going to have to do that. The old ones will not interface with the new program.

Councilmember Tornatta: Can the Voter Registration computers, can they work with the Election Office to get that project done?

Councilmember Abell: We’d have to ask the Voter Registration Office. I think probably physically they could, but I’m not sure that workload, they can.

Councilmember Tornatta: Well, I know that at times, and not to discredit anybody’s workload, but I know that at times we’ve talked about sometimes there is, and I know it’s a busy time for them, but if there is a way that we can utilize the Voter’s Registration so we don’t have to double buy computers to do the same job, that would be something we’d be interested in. That’s eleven computers and, truthfully, its eleven computers I didn’t know about until 8:15 this morning, okay, so obviously, we didn’t have this list, so its going to be awful hard for me to vote on anything when I don’t get it and I don’t know who’s issue that was, but, you know, its something I want to look it. The DADS –

President Winnecke: Can I interrupt? Are you, because I want to make sure I understand your suggestion, you’re suggesting, asking if the eleven existing or the existing computers in the Election Office, whether they can be upgraded?

Councilmember Tornatta: No, I guess what I’m asking is if the computers that are in Voter Registration can help to facilitate a job that should be possibly done by the Election Office?

President Winnecke: Okay, I apologize for cutting you off, I just wanted to make sure we all understand that before you went on.

Councilmember Abell: Tim could answer that, from a technical standpoint, yes, but I can tell you that from a statutory standpoint, no, because Vanderburgh County is one of three counties in the State of Indiana that does not allow the Election Office and the Voter Registration Office to function together. They have to function separately by state statute.

Councilmember Abell: I wanted to get it changed. I have no idea why we’re one of only three. In most counties the Voter Registration Office functions under the office of the Clerk and they do joint duties, but there are three counties that have it set separately, it was done years ago and I don’t know why.

Councilmember Tornatta: It just seems kind of inefficient and maybe that’s something that we ought to bring up and I appreciate you bringing that to light, Ms. Abell. The other thing that I’d like to talk about, the DADS program, six computers, now I thought we voted a year, year and a half ago, put about a $30,000 package that I was a part of to bring computers to their office and this says DT, I guess that’s desktop?

Councilmember Tornatta: Okay, make sure when you make these things for computer illiterates like myself that you put some type of reference to what your codes are here, but in computer talk the DT says they need six and I guess I was wanting to know, I’m their liaison, and I stay in touch with them, but I didn’t hear anything about six new computers.

Tim VanCleave: That comes from the request of this Council two years ago to make sure that DADS was included in the next process of this nature.

Councilmember Tornatta: Okay. Well, we need to reconstruct this list. We asked for a critical list, not a wish list and I think that, right now, we don’t necessarily have that and, like I said, no offense to you, but in order to get a list that we’re going to feel comfortable with, we’re going to need that true list and we’d appreciate, I think I speak for some of us, that we’d like to get with all bodies that are in control of the computer system whether that’s Mr. Arvay or others that are associated with it, and try and come up with a list that’s going to be efficient and best suited for this county.

Tim VanCleave: The DADS was added on there only because of the request that this Council made. I had made note and carried through on the promise I had made to this Council.

President Winnecke: Thank you. Anyone on this side? Were you done, Mr. Tornatta?

President Winnecke: I just have a few questions. I’m trying to make sure all the numbers are foot here, and getting to the previous point, I’m not sure that I understand everything that I’m reading here, so on page – I guess, page two, that begins with the header, Detail Breakdown of Unit Information, Server CAL 350, what is that? Three hundred and fifty servers?

Tim VanCleave: No. The Microsoft licensing program, Microsoft just changed their licensing program to where you have to buy a license for the server, which is the first line item there, which has a quantity of 13. Then each workstation that is going to attach to those servers has to have a, what they call a client access license, and what I am trying to include is any of the external public safety that may be attaching to Courtview to determine warrants and those type of elements, to be able to connect.

President Winnecke: So that explanation would – that would explain the difference between 350 and 316?

President Winnecke: Okay. And then would the same explanation apply on the lower third of the same page relating to Microsoft Office, SmartTerm and Adobe?

President Winnecke: And what’s, where does it all go? I mean, I would think that number would match the 350.

Tim VanCleave: The difference is that there are additional offices outside of public safety that attach via what we call a Citrix Solution, and those additional licenses that are residing on the Citrix Solution. The Citrix Solution is, for lack of a better definition, you remember the old mainframe days where everything was on a central box and then you just had a, what we call dumb terminal, that really had no computing power on the outside? The Citrix Solution is a hybrid of client server technology and the mainframe technology. While there are other offices that would normally have to tie up the Clerk’s library public terminals to get information, we have provided a mechanism where, regardless of what speed their computer is, they can access at a read-only method and not degradate the performance of the courts trying to input data into the system. So that is why there’s a larger increase there.

Councilmember Tornatta: Hold on a second. Tim, we’re going to need BOTOX after this because our foreheads are so crunched.

Tim VanCleave: That’s why I was focusing on a conceptual table with the one before, because when you start getting into the details, –

President Winnecke: Well, I’m just trying to make sure the numbers, why the numbers don’t all foot.

Councilmember Tornatta: Can I make one quick suggestion today and then we’ll– excuse me. Can we get a computer guy doing what he does best and an interpreter to kind of break it down to a simpler form and work with all those groups and then bring it back to the Council? I think to interpret all this stuff on the floor is a little monotonous to try to go through some of this stuff and we need to ask what some abbreviations are, we need to ask where some of these things go and you probably can’t do it. I know some people got it yesterday afternoon and you still can’t do it in a 12-hour period, and I mean, you spent 30 years of your life or how many on computers, so I know that you’re a little bit more astute into that than we are. But maybe if we can get a clarification and package this so that it would be a more sellable item, then we can go from there.

President Winnecke: I think that’s a great idea and if you can work on that, I would appreciate it but I still have a couple of other questions that I think we can all understand. Again, on the bottom of that same page, the line that begins Office Printers 62, below that Large Capacity Printers 3, and below that Multi-function Printers (Judges Offices) 10, so that’s 75 printers, is that right?

Tim VanCleave: That, the printer summary is the total printers that I have physically went through and counted.

President Winnecke: Okay, so this is just an inventory, this does not represent the list that will all be replaced.

Tim VanCleave: And one of the things that I have found in talking to the judges that helps make them be more productive during their meetings is the ability to have a multi-function device inside their office. There are a lot of times where they interrupt a meeting to make a photocopy of something that somebody has brought to them and they go to the photocopier, make the photocopy, bring it back and then start to resume their discussions. Where, if they had a, you know, low end device like I’ve proposed here, they have the ability to make that photocopy right there inside the chambers, never breaking the meeting and continuing forward and probably Judge Knight can better attest to that, but the idea of trying to provide that same functionality, we have been, some of the Judges have started doing that and we will at least want to put it into the budget. Some of the judges may not want to do that. But we at least wanted to be equal across all the judges to provide that opportunity for their efficiencies.

President Winnecke: The last question that I think I have represents the two totals, the two columns under totals, could you help us understand the difference between the two? For instance, servers, there is a figure of 72,000 and next to that, 76,500.

Tim VanCleave: I was providing a range of estimation, because until we have the funding in place and actually provide a closer bill of materials to Dell or HP under the state QPA’s or if we go out for RFP, we won’t actually have a fixed amount to come back to.

President Winnecke: So those just are estimates of each of those? Okay, that’s good to know.

Tim VanCleave: What I tried to do is provide a low range and a high range and I –

Councilmember Sutton: One other thing just real quick, there are a couple of items in here like PDA’s, where are those utilized?

Tim VanCleave: The Judges and Magistrates and the people that are calendaring their work and significantly mobile. This would allow them to carry their contacts and their calendar along with them and to keep it all synchronized when they come back to their office.

Tim VanCleave: I always work from the viewpoint of county officials having county assets that are managed by county resources. If the Council wants to strike that and have the Judges purchase that, then we do come back to the issue of does the county still let us as an IT organization support those devices.

Councilmember Sutton: I would say yes but notebooks, notebook computers, I guess that’s what that is, –

Councilmember Sutton: Who is using – I mean, how many people out there are using laptops?

Tim VanCleave: There’s about 25 presently. The juvenile probation department uses that as part of their outreach program into the schools, there are in the Prosecutor’s Office, the child support office carries notebooks into court many times to help calculate the child support payments. There are additional needs for inside of the courtroom where presentations, because presentations don’t usually come on overheard projectors anymore. So the court is in some need and that was also the reason for the projectors is so that a computer can be set up with a projector inside of the courtroom and presentations can be made during court as well as some additional, as the Judges travel, giving them the ability to check their email and those type of items when they’re on the road.

Councilmember Sutton: You know, I think we can best help you, you know, obviously, there’s a lot of questions here, we can best help you in providing, you know, additional questions or maybe ways in which suggestions on how you could maybe format this so that it can be a little bit more understandable. I know kind of in your world, this is probably very elementary and very understandable for all the folks that do what you do, but for those of us who don’t do this on a daily basis, this is high level calculus. But if, as we are looking at this, and the questions that we have is some of its due to our lack of experience with this. As we go back and consider this request, these are some of the things that maybe we can do to help you make it understandable for us and so that the presentation and the decision that we ultimately make, we can all feel comfortable with. Right now, I think, at least on my part and I can’t speak for everyone, there is a high degree of uncomfortableness because of this, so much equipment and so much is being asked here, and we just want to get our arms around it so that we can know that whatever we decide to do, that we are making a good decision.

Tim VanCleave: Right, and that’s where, if you go back one page in that, you’ll see at the bottom there is a conceptual organization which tries to better group the basic request, which was made by Councilman Goebel to, you know, what are the numbers of items that we are purchasing. But even there if you take a look and see that there is, you know, two servers and one spot costs $103,000 and in the next spot seven servers cost $95,000, in that conceptual table, the first question comes up, well, what is the difference. And that’s where the next table, just to try to show that those aren’t random numbers that are put in there for a per cost. And that is the challenge. And even for people who do this day in and day out, because of Microsoft changing their licensing program, they used to have something a lot easier called server based or processor based licensing. You bought one license for the server and everybody could attach at no additional cost. Well, now Microsoft has changed their licensing program to where you can only buy a server and client access licenses. So it’s a changing world for us as well.

Councilmember Raben: Just real quick, Mr. President, I might offer a suggestion. We’ve kind of hinted around it on and off for the last fifteen minutes, but possibly yourself, and maybe Marsha because of her knowledge with working with the courts and maybe Royce or Troy? Royce. If you could possibly get together with Tim and Judge Knight in advance of our filing deadline for, which will be the fifteenth of the month, right, of next month, that would be very helpful and we’ll just take your recommendation. I did have a question for you, Tim, just to – relating back to, I think originally the whole Courtview programming and our last lease program on the actual equipment itself, I think we started that in `99, a lot of the equipment was not online until probably 2001, is that correct?

Councilmember Raben: By 2000? But looking back, I think our lease five years ago or four –

Tim VanCleave: About 250 was the budget for the lease payments in 2003 and 2004.

Tim VanCleave: We are a little higher today than what we were because of some expansion. They have opened four new courtrooms. As an easy example here today of some of the expansion, there was as I mentioned last time, some of the elements that were removed out of the project such as courtroom benches. The Judges actually having workstations available to them on the bench during court. The training room, we came up with a way of making a training room but that was initially cut out of that project and now that the room that we’re using for training, the Building Authority is wanting to return that back to what it was so there is some additional needs to look at another way of providing workstations for training. So that is some of the reason why the change in cost from then to now.

Councilmember Raben: I was trying to remember the figure, like a million two kind of sticks in my mind, and that might have been for the actual Courtview software package in itself. But that’s history, so we won’t need to address it any further. Again, if we could follow up with the committee –

President Winnecke: I think the committee has started to work already. That’s a great idea, Mr. Raben, and we will proceed in that manner. Just one, actually two small requests, Councilman Goebel did ask for sort of the itemized list which you have provided – we do appreciate that. Councilman Tornatta did ask also, and this would be helpful, the equipment that is, I mean, critical, if for some reason we decide we can only do a piece of it, we would like to know which pieces need to go first. If Judge Knight’s printer, as we talked about last month, is ready to blow up, we need to fix that. And we need to know that also in sort of in context with the entire request. So the committee, we can flesh all that out in the coming weeks. And then, lastly, I would encourage you to include in your discussions, include the county’s chief information officer in this. I appreciate you’re not wanting to overwhelm him, but he is compensated to kind of oversee the entire enterprise and this is a big piece of the enterprise, so I would ask that you also do that and maybe Mr. Arvay can be a part of the meeting of our little ad hoc technical whizbang committee here going forward. So the motion on the floor is to set this in at zero for the time being or do we just need to defer that, Mr. Raben?

Councilmember Tornatta: We’ve kind of worked it the same way. Its zeroed or deferred.

Councilmember Raben: It will have to be readvertised be it deferred or zeroed, so leave it at zero.

President Winnecke: And I would just offer one other comment and maybe this, maybe, I don’t know if it’s a comment more for Mr. Arvay, but to the extent that the Election Office needs these eleven, is it eleven? Eleven computers, I don’t know if that is in your queue or not, but the Council does have money appropriated or budgeted for computer type issues. So, you know, if you can look into that and we can act on that next month if that’s a request, or if that’s a necessary need. So hopefully we can take care of the Election Office needs in a timely fashion, too. Thank you for your patience. I know this has been tedious, but its been helpful.

Councilmember Raben: Okay, Mr. President, we’ll move back to Election Office. I have a memo that has been sent from the Commissioner’s Office and that is that the Kinder Expense for moving the election equipment has always been paid out of the Election Office contractual account and the County Commissioners do not have funds in the 2006 budget. That’s the memo, so Mr. President, I think at this time just to make sure that we don’t run into any kinks for the primary, let’s – I would like to stick with my original motion to set this in at $10,000.

President Winnecke: We do have a motion and a second. We do have a second, correct?

Councilmember Tornatta: I’m going to vote yes just because I want to see the election equipment go out but I’m kind of disappointed in the Commissioners.

Councilmember Abell: Before I vote, I have a question. If we don’t get any responses to this, what are we going to do? Are we going to just tell Susie its her problem?

Councilmember Raben: The motion is to set it in at the amount requested so we do have funds available.

Councilmember Goebel: I need a clarification on that. The Clerk will have to come to us at the next meeting?

President Winnecke: Ms. Abell’s concern is that this is not enough money to attract a vendor to do the work necessary. She thinks the bids will come in higher than this amount.

Councilmember Tornatta: There are probably 50 vendors for this, so if Kinder doesn’t want to do it, I’m sure somebody will actively pursue it. They say the same thing about the tire bid every year. So nobody likes it, its just part of doing business.

Councilmember Goebel: Okay, I want to personally with my vote make sure that we have funding to get the machines out, so like it or not, I guess I vote yes.

Councilmember Raben: Okay, we had skipped over Public Defender. Mr. President, I’ll move that the Public Defender request in the amount of $2,493 be approved.

Jeff Ahlers: I’ve never heard from them. I assume, I emailed to you if I have the right email address, did you get a copy of my letter?

Jeff Ahlers: As I said in the letter, you know, a month ago, I tried to call that Mike Murphy several times. He never returned my calls, so I felt in order to cover ourselves, I sent a letter just confirming that we tried to call, that he hadn’t called back and that, you know, the letter is a little unclear, but that we thought a fair interpretation would be that we would not be penalized. However, I think as you pointed out at the last meeting, if you want to be a hundred percent sure, I guess for $2,493 you know you’re going to get reimbursed, but still no response to my letter. So I don’t know what to say. I’m not sure what’s going on up there at the Public Defender Commission, but they haven’t been real responsive.

Councilmember Tornatta: Well, I know that we’ve kind of kicked this around and kicking and screaming, so to speak, but as we talked last time, for less than $2,500 we’re assured that we’re going to get our full reimbursement which mounds up there at times, so maybe we have a little bit of a momentum if we want our monies sent to us, to get them on the hook. So anyway, I appreciate you looking into it, but I think we’re doing the right thing.

Councilmember Raben: Okay, next under County Highway, Mr. President, I’ll move that the request be approved as listed for a total of $12,457.

President Winnecke: Motion and a second. Questions or discussion? Roll call vote please.

Councilmember Raben: Cum Bridge, Mr. President, in the amount of $50,000. I’ll move approval.

President Winnecke: Motion and a second. Questions or discussion? Roll call vote please.

Councilmember Raben: Okay, Reassessment/Scott Township in the amount of $23,625, I’ll move approval.

President Winnecke: Mr. Wortman, did you address this last time? I’ve forgotten what you said.

Councilmember Wortman: At budget time we took it out and didn’t put it into Reassessment fund.

Councilmember Raben: Okay, and last under transfers, I’ll move, there is a transfer for Superintendent of County Buildings in the amount of a dollar and Superior Court in the amount of $1,615. I’ll move approval.

President Winnecke: Motion and a second. Questions or discussions on the transfers? Roll call vote please.

President Winnecke: Okay, next are the amendments to the Salary Ordinance, Mr. President, we have about four pages of amendments. I’m simply going to move and ask that these be entered and made part of the minutes.

President Winnecke: Motion and a second. Questions or discussions on amendments to the Salary Ordinance? Roll call vote please.

President Winnecke: Under Old Business, our Museum Board appointment has asked to not be reappointed after we made the appointment.

President Winnecke: Did we find a -- I’m pointing at Royce. I’m sorry, I don’t mean to be rude. Did we talk about the Library Board appointment? I forgot if we did.

Councilmember Sutton: We’re kind of back and forth on that and we didn’t get a chance to chat, but you had mentioned one name and I had mentioned another name and so I didn’t know if –

1051-1850	Union Overtime	75,000.00	30,000.00
Total		75,000.00	30,000.00

1361-1850	Union Overtime	40,000.00	25,000.00
1361-1330-1361	Correction Officer	2,560.00	2,560.00
1361-1440-1361	Correction Officer	2,965.00	2,965.00
Total		45,525.00	30,525.00

1090-1120-1090	Chief Deputy	1,428.00	928.00
1090-1900	FICA	110.00	71.00
1090-1910	PERF	86.00	56.00
Total		1,624.00	1,055.00

1480-3860	Contractual Computer	450,000.00	0.00
Total		450,000.00	0.00

1210-3530	Contractual Services	10,000.00	10,000.00
Total		10,000.00	10,000.00

1303-1620-1303	Chief Public Defender	2,193.00	2,193.00
1303-1900	FICA	168.00	168.00
1303-1910	PERF	132.00	132.00
Total		2,493.00	2,493.00

2010-1060	Mechanic	10,000.00	10,000.00
2010-1065	Leadman	1.00	1.00
2010-1066	Maint. & Utility	1.00	1.00
2010-1068	Gasman	1.00	1.00
2010-1020	Truck Driver	1.00	1.00
2010-1021	Truck Driver	1.00	1.00
2010-1022	Truck Driver	1.00	1.00
2010-1023	Truck Driver	1.00	1.00
2010-1024	Truck Driver	1.00	1.00
2010-1025	Truck Driver	1.00	1.00
2010-1026	Truck Driver	1.00	1.00
2010-1027	Truck Driver	1.00	1.00
2010-1028	Truck Driver	1.00	1.00
2010-1029	Truck Driver	1.00	1.00
2010-1030	Equipment Operator	1.00	1.00
2010-1031	Equipment Operator	1.00	1.00
2010-1033	Equipment Operator	1.00	1.00
2010-1035	Equipment Operator	1.00	1.00
2010-1036	Equipment Operator	1.00	1.00
2010-1037	Equipment Operator	1.00	1.00
2010-1038	Equipment Operator	1.00	1.00
2010-1530	Shift Differential	2,437.00	2,437.00
Total		12,457.00	12,457.00

2030-4412	Old State Road Bridge #4412	50,000.00	50,000.00
Total		50,000.00	50,000.00

2490-1160-3120	Postage/Freight	1,500.00	1,500.00
2490-1160-3130	Travel/Mileage	1,500.00	1,500.00
2490-1160-3140	Telephone	1,200.00	1,200.00
2490-1160-3410	Printing	1,000.00	1,000.00
2490-1160-3520	Equipment Repair	1,500.00	1,500.00
2490-1160-3540	Maint. Contract	775.00	775.00
2490-1160-1990	Extra Help	15,000.00	15,000.00
2490-1160-1900	FICA	1,150.00	1,150.00
Total		23,625.00	23,625.00