President Wortman: I want to open the reassessment appropriation ordinance this August the second is now in session and we are going to have a roll call vote, please.

(Inaudible)

President Wortman: I mean, attendance, I am sorry I looked at the wrong line. 

(Teri Lukeman called the roll.)
 

*(Councilmember Hoy arrived after attendance roll call)

President Wortman: Okay, we've got, one, two, three, four, five, six, one absent and what's on the agenda so that we get to moving is what I would like to do is take a motion from the floor and then a second and then we don't have to read anything as what we are going to do as listed on this paper. So, that a way we won't be interrupting anything and everybody can get back to work. So, I will take a motion for that effect.

Councilmember Smith: Mr. Chairman, I make a motion that we approve as set in on our meeting that we had last week.

President Wortman: As listed.

Councilmember Smith: As listed.

President Wortman: As listed and do I have a second?

Councilman Bassemier: Second.

President Wortman: Second. Any discussion.

Councilmember Raben: Mr. President, I apologize for the past 9 or 10 days that I have been away. (Inaudible) I still am not comfortable with quite a few of these. I think that we are still talking about way too much money for a five month period. Some of the smaller ones, they seem like they are extremely reasonable requests. There is even a few of the larger ones, for instance, I think that Perry's request is somewhat reasonable although I questioned the Extra Help. Some of the other large ones I think, at this point in time, is still too much money, we are talking $600, let me find my figure, $ 680,000 in total requests for a five month budget. 

President Wortman: I think it was $450,000 if I remember right.

Councilmember Raben: No, it is $680,000. Our total budgets for 18 months for the last reassessment was roughly 1 to 2 million. I just think that we are being a little too generous at this stage of the game with these requests or with the amounts that are being requested and what I would like to ask this Council to do is maybe not act on this today and give us until Wednesday and we can act on this during our normal meeting.

President Wortman: No, this is a special meeting and we have to act on it and it's their money and they got to get to going. They were supposed to get started July 1 but I have talked to McIntyre and he said that they can go out and collect their data and they want to get going and they got a chance to get some help and there might be some accounts that is a little over funded and some are under funded and we've got to get it a-going. We all met and hashed this all out and we are all ready to go. So, if there is any other questions.

Councilmember Raben: I do. I want to...let me finish.

President Wortman: Okay.

Councilmember Raben: I think that it would be far more responsible for this body to consider the fact again that we are dealing with five months. A lot of this five months we are going into the wintertime so you will not be in the field as much as you would during the spring and summer.

Paul Hatfield: Oh, what are you talking about?

Councilmember Raben: There's certain requests here, one township office is asking for 

$ 5,000 in Travel/Mileage. That equates to 17,857 miles (inaudible) I think that two more days to have a little more equitable budget certainly makes sense.

President Wortman: Well, what they don't use they will turn back in and they realize that. Just like these books, there are not going to use them, order them books, until we got them at once. They all understand that and everything kind of worked out and that's why we got everybody together. So, has anybody else got...?

Councilmember Smith: I just wonder, Jim, why didn't you make the issue of this when we were sitting over there in that room when we had the public hearing? Why wait to the day of the vote to bring it up?

Councilmember Raben: Betty, I think if you remember correctly, I argued probably too much on this same point. In fact, some of these, one particular assessor was even yelling at me for trying to make just this point. 

Councilmember Smith: But, you should have made your motion then to have cut anything you wanted and brought it to a vote and not wait until we get here ready for the final. If you have a question about it then just vote against it.

Councilmember Raben: What you need to realize is that this is not the type of fund at the end of the year, comes back to our discretion. I mean-

Councilmember Smith: But I question the $500,000 that we put, when it really wasn't for reassessment. I questioned that because I don't think that it was reassessment money. I mean it was reassessment money but it wasn't for reassessment.

President Wortman: We just can't keep postponing this because we keep postponing it and we are late now and they have to get to going that's the whole thing.

Councilmember Bassemier: Just one-

President Wortman: Mr. Bassemier.

Councilmember Bassemier; Jim, I know that you brought up Travel/$5,000, looks like that is Knight Township. I am the liaison officer for that department, Mr. Folz is out there. Al would you come forward please and explain why that $5,000, so that, I just don't want something to be up in the air and I would like to know the reason why.

Al Folz: Okay, which one?

Councilmember Bassemier: Oh, that's the Travel and Mileage, Mr. Raben mentioned $5,000 and he thinks that is too high and I was just...

Al Folz: Al Folz, Knight Township Assessor. Well, Mr. Councilmember, this is my fourth reassessment and I do know what it takes to run one. I have to get people out in the field and we have to have a field coordinator to go out and check them and they do get paid because of their mileage. This is something in fact that was cut and I think you cut it. 

Councilmember Raben: Are you going to travel 17, 857 miles over a five month period in your township?

Al Folz: I don't know what they are all going to be doing yet, but I have to have enough money in there to be doing it. What I can't see is that we are going to be out here reassessing and we've got almost 26,500 going on 27,000 parcels out here and we've got maybe 1200 subdivisions and people have got to get out there and do it. Now, if you can do it any cheaper, sir, then why don't you come over and I'll hire you and you go out and do this dog gone thing because I do need something to operate on. I can't spend it if we don't use it just for that.

Councilmember Raben: Let me ask you a question. On your $26,000 Extra Help request.

How many people is that?

Al Folz: Eight.

Councilmember Raben: Eight.

Al Folz: Eight and you approved it.

Councilmember Raben: How soon would they come aboard?

Al Folz: Well, I am going to get some of them already this month and get more of them out there. I have to run about 60,000 copies to begin with also. These people that I can get used to and I have to be able to train them.

Councilmember Raben: That's exactly right. Before they go out in the field you also have to train them. 

Al Folz: And they will be out with an experienced person also. 

Councilmember Raben: Another one is Unemployment. I don't think that you are going to run into that situation....

Al Folz: Well, you should have voted against it. You didn't and you were there.

Councilmember Raben: I argued enough on that day. This is where my vote counts.

Al Folz: You know you never did even call me to discuss any of these things.

Councilmember Raben: I went out of town on the very next day. 

Al Folz: Okay, that's fine but I didn't. I was here.

Councilmember Raben: Again, I would like to ask this Council, I know that Royce and Ed weren't present. I know that Russ and Phil weren't present and I will take a lot of the heat and I planned a year ago to be gone and it just worked out...

Al Folz: I understand, I understand. 

Councilmember Raben: Actually, at the time, I thought that we were going to vote on this Wednesday of this week anyway. It wasn't until, actually yesterday (inaudible)

Al Folz: You know actually we have a big job to do. We have to be able to reassess everything in this county and to take and nickel and dime us to death to be able to get a good job done it just really doesn't hold with me.

Councilmember Raben: I am not saying that we nickel and dime you, it's just $ 680,000 for a five month budget...

Al Folz: Well, you just gave out $500,000 just like that not too long ago.

Councilmember Hoy: Well, that's true, but that was for geographical information...

Al Folz: I understand that but it still came out of the reassessment fund and we can't use that right now even.

Councilmember Hoy: I know that but it is unfair to compare those two expenditures because that is comparing apples to oranges and in my estimation that is all that I am saying.

Councilmember Raben: You know today would be a good day to actually, I am sure that some of these other individuals have some questions. I know that last reassessment I am looking at Training, and Glen, you were responsible for organizing the training and I know that there were several requests for $ 3,000 and there is one in here for $ 5,000 and we could probably train everybody through another two or three sessions for four or $5,000. 

Al Folz: Well, if you can set it up like that then by golly we can try it. 

Glen Koob: Glen Koob, Perry Township Assessor. The reason for the training this time is because we're doing the reassessment differently as far as pricing. We are going to market value so therefore we need IAAO training classes and I am not going to be able to train them this time because we are going to have depreciation the way the market looks at depreciation and not the way, the state is not going to give us a manual, that is why the cost of the $435 per manual per office or whatever it is per manual and that is the reason why because the state is not giving us a per se manual which was free last time. But, the training, we have to go to IAAO classes and also the legislature passed, I believe it was in 1983 and 1998 that the assessors for sure have to have so many hours of training, like 45 hours of training and I think that it is 16 or 18 that have to be tested in a two year period. That is the reason why for the training.

Councilmember Raben: Glen, is it not possible again to have group training?

Glen Koob: Oh, sure but it costs $315 or $320 per person to go to a week IAAO class.

Councilmember Raben: Okay, but before did you not bring those people in here?

Glen Koob: Yes, we are bringing, Ms. Musgrave has been paying out of her budget, a year or so ago, for that IAAO training and I believe that it was over $3,000 for 23 of us to go. 

Councilmember Raben: That might be a good idea, if we put the training into the assessors budget, what kind of money would we be looking at?

Paul Hatfield: That is a different type of training.

Glen Koob: That's right. I mean there's different training.

Councilmember Raben: Well, I mean to do the training, we need to do in house.

Glen Koob: We also, the State Tax Board also gives us training classes, once a, four times a year in Vincennes, and we have to travel to Vincennes and we have been trying to get them down here in Evansville, but they haven't given it to us in two years, so we have to go four times a year to Vincennes. Also, we just had our conference, the township assessors conference, at the Executive Inn, which was luckily in Evansville, which didn't cost the Council or Vanderburgh County any money, other than per diem I guess, also the County Assessor has a couple of schools a year so this year they are going to have a couple. So there is more than, I wouldn't put it all in one, I don't believe. 

Councilmember Raben: Let me just ask this question to Al. Now, last year for this year in your reassessment we budgeted $7,000.

Al Folz: And you cut it down to $5,000.

Councilmember Raben: No, we allowed $7,000.

Al Folz: Uh-uh. Uh-uh.

President Wortman: Training is $5,000, what's listed.

Al Folz: You cut it down from seven to five at your motion.

Councilmember Raben: Okay, of that $5,000 what has been expended out of that account?

Al Folz: I beg your pardon?

Councilmember Raben: How much have you spent of that $5,000?

Al Folz: Well, we haven't spent anything because we don't have any money. I can't spend something that I don't have.

Councilmember Raben: Okay, I said that we allowed, on your reassessment budget last year, $ 7,000. You said that we cut it to five, then you just stated that you haven't spent anything because we didnt give you anything.

Al Folz: You didn't.

Councilmember Raben: (Inaudible) 

Al Folz: You are talking about two different budgets.

Councilmember Raben: I am talking about reassessment in `99.

Al Folz: Shirley, how much did we spend out of our training budget?

Councilmember Raben: According to my budget book, we allowed $7,000. (Inaudible) Well, this is what was budgeted for last year. This total reassessment budget was $34,135.

Al Folz: Um, Um.

Glen Koob: They gave us the money for the maps and the plats, Al.

Al Folz: What?

Glen Koob: When they gave us the money for the maps, they gave us money for training and something else, four things.

Councilmember Smith: Mr. Chairman?

Al Folz: Again, she would have that...

Councilmember Raben: But again, in the last thirty days we have been given the go ahead on what or how we are going to assess this year and I know that $7,000 hasn't been expended yet.

Al Folz: Well, do we have that in our budget? Can you tell by your book?

Councilmember Raben: Well, that's what...

Al Folz: Well, remember we hassled this around at the three man meeting I think also quite a bit.

Glen Koob: If you did not encumber it last year then you don't have it this year.

President Wortman: Anytime you encumber something it is on a contract or specify what you are doing.

Councilmember Raben: I don't believe that is correct on this account.

Glen Koob: On the reassessment account.

Suzanne Crouch: I believe in the past you all allowed it just to continue to roll forward, I am not sure that is acceptable, I will check with the state. But, the monies should not be encumbered unless there was a contract or a P.O.

Councilmember Raben: But, again this was budgeted in >98 for >99, so those funds would not have even been put in place until January of this year, so those funds would be in that account this year.

Councilmember Hoy: (Inaudible)

Councilmember Raben: No, they were budgeted last year for this year.

Glen Koob: We encumbered ours last year in `98. We encumbered four funds, training, maps, computers, remember you gave us those computers, hardware and software, so we had to encumber those, well I did, I encumbered my accounts and rolled them over to this year. So, we did get them sometime in `98 and rolled them...

Councilmember Raben: Okay.

Glen Koob: It was a budget hearing in `98 that we got them.

Councilmember Raben: Correct and I assumed that we got them after the first of this year.

Glen Koob: (Inaudible) in the past reassessment because it was an ongoing, it is not a year time period, it is a five year period. So, that is why I understood that we could roll it over or encumber it.

Al Folz: That's what I understood.

Glen Koob: I don't know.

Councilmember Raben: From a personal standpoint, as I look through here, I think that Armstrong's budget is very suitable, I think German's, although I think that their, let me find it here, their's looks suitable...

Councilmember Bassemier: Thank you, Al.

Councilmember Raben: Perry is, outside of the Extra Help, I think that, you know, we can always come back and reappropriate later this year, but I think that figure is a little higher that what we need right now. I think Pigeon is the same way, I think there is a lot of, you hate to use the term fat, but I think that there is a lot that could be cut from that. Scott, we are giving Scott a new Field Coordinator, yet, $25,000 in Extra Help. I mean that to me seems like that is far too much. Union looks good. I mean..

President Wortman: I talked with Scott today and told them, and that was my fault that I made a mistake and they should have had about ten but it was overlooked and I made a mistake and they are not going to spend it and they guaranteed me and just like them Assessors out there, they are not going to spend more than this, it is their money, and they have to get to going and I don't think that there is anything that, whether it is over funded or under funded, we have to get them going and we can't be perfect with this.

Councilmember Raben: We meet two days a month and we are going to do that for the next five months. So, to me I just think that we are crazy to jump in this deep, this quick, for five months work.

President Wortman: Paul, do you want to say something? He wants to say something and then Glen wants to say something. 

Paul Hatfied: This is a very, very simple problem, your 600 and something is wrong and..

President Wortman: That's what I told him.

Paul Hatfied: Now this is the problem. The problem is that we are meeting here today for you to vote on this budget for the remaining part of 1999 and then it has to go to the state for approval and that>s gonna take probably two weeks. Now, that throws us in, instead of starting July 1, I have six people hired, very good people, for field work. They are going to be coming to work on August 23, with the help of God and an expeditious state approval. Now, that is the main course of getting us going. We have about 20,000 parcels, of various kinds. I have got to get these people in the field. Now, Mr. Raben, can argue with me all he wants to about what figure, what figure, so forth and so on down the line but let me tell you there is not a salary spot or Extra Help spot in any of these budgets that I have seen, the fact is, in one township that I have looked at, their Extra Help is low, depending on the number of parcels that they have and that is what you have to keep in mind. You can compare Scott and German but you're talking about apples and oranges if you are talking about Knight and Pigeon. Now, it has been said here and it is true, we have gleaned this thing down. I could tell you exactly where you could cut my budget today and I don't give a damn as far as the $453 for manuals, but by the time when we get them ordered, and I will give you a suggestion, order them through the County Assessor's office. Let her order all of the manuals, if we don't spend it all then it will be there. A budget is not spending. You are not putting out the dollars on a budget, you have to wait until they are spent until you are hurt. Remember this, we are your cash cow and you keep bringing us up here like orphans and I am going to tell you now that you may not have this money to spend the next year, or the year after, or the year after that. If we don't have the help to do the job then you are not going to get the money to spend. It is just that simple. If it, I tell you what, we don't spend a damn dime that we don't need to spend. Nothing. I can show the figures on my sheet back there is my, in a file. The $42,024 for Extra Help is and will be spent . It will be spent. Now, when you consider what we have to do when making these inspections, you are gettin' off cheap. You don't have anything else to consider but to get us off the mark. Just remember, it was supposed to start July 1, through no fault of yours, we are not starting July 1 and because of what has to happen now on August 2, we are going to have to almost wait until the end of August to get started. But, I have people in place to go to work on August 23. I don't think that you have, that is a no-brainer, now the rest of this stuff, let me tell you. I don't know what your opinion is but I don't know of any township assessor that is sitting in their office saying we've got $3,000 to spend, let's spend it. Nobody does that, nobody does, I know that we don't and I know that everybody sitting in this room doesn't do it but when we need the money it has to be available. The fact is, I lost two very, very good people that I would have loved to have hired instead of the two that I did, who are also very good, simply because I couldn't start them, in my opinion until August 23. Now, if the state backs up on us it would be longer than that. We have to get into the field. Now, you are talking about winter months, we don't have that cold of winter months. These people will be in the field in the winter. I have talked with every one of them. In my case, you have no problem here, just get us started, by God. Because I am going to tell you it is going to be one hell of a job to get it done in the time period that we are supposed to get it done in now because of what the State Tax Board has done. So, all that I have to say is, have a little faith. We are not lying to you. We are not lying to you. 

President Wortman: Thank you, Paul.

Councilmember Hoy: Mr. President.

President Wortman: Mr. Hoy.

Councilmember Hoy: First of all, I have to apologize that I was not at the hearing and most of us sitting around this table have other jobs and my national charity was in for their two day audit and I simply have to be there for that and could not be here for that. I have a question that I think will help me today and that is can, okay. I am looking at Center's budget and it is $51,490 and Knight is $135,000 and Pigeon is only $107,000 and I am assuming, Mr. Hatfield, that you have as many parcels as Knight has or maybe more or you do not.

Paul Hatfield: No, what we have down here is double of what Center's got. That's what I have been talking about.

Councilmember Hoy: I would like for somebody to come to the mike so that I get this on record. I would like to know how many parcels. My question is, how many parcels does each township have because that will help me look at this in a more factual way. There is one thing that I would vote against right now and I tell you because I can't understand at all, nor do I want to put $30,000 or $25,000 into Scott Township for Extra Help. I think that figure is completely out of line. You mentioned that ten was more in line, and I would feel just on one line, I would feel more comfortable with ten there than 25 since that seems like a fair thing.

President Wortman: Excuse me, Mr. Hoy. You probably wasn't here when I mentioned that was an oversight on me. It was supposed to have been ten and I didn't.

Councilmember Hoy: Yes, I did hear you say that.

President Wortman: Okay, okay, I called them and they are not going to spend it. It is already in place.

Councilmember Hoy: Well, why can't we just change it?

President Wortman: Well, we got to get going here and open up everything, we are never going to get something done. We wanted to fax this up-

Councilmember Hoy: Let me hear the answer to my first question, how many parcels?

President Wortman: Okay, let Cheryl Musgrave, she will give that to you.

Cheryl Musgrave: I feel like I am being ganged up on here. Cheryl Musgrave, County Assessor. If you will look at the little spreadsheet that I gave you today.

Councilmember Hoy: This one?

Cheryl Musgrave: Yeah, underneath the annual totals line, which is underlined there near the bottom of the page, there is a line that says parcels and as you go across it will show a number. Do you see that, Mr. Hoy?

Councilmember Hoy: Okay, parcels.

Cheryl Musgrave: That is the number of parcels that existed I think at about a year, 12 months, 18 months ago, and as we all know parcels go up and down over time. So you just view that as a guide not a fixed in stone number.

Councilmember Hoy: Okay.

Cheryl Musgrave; Now, there was some confusion earlier about the total amount of requests whether it was $600,000 or $400,000. This spreadsheet lists all appropriations requested from the Reassessment Fund. I am not clear as to what is on the table today whether it is the Auditor, the Assessors, the Board of Appeals and the Townships or just the Townships.

Councilmember Raben: They are just referring to Townships.

Cheryl Musgrave: Just the Townships.

Councilmember Hoy: Townships.

Cheryl Musgrave: So the Townships may be at 400 and some number and then when you add in the other three requests...

Councilmember Raben: They make it 600.

Cheryl Musgrave: Right, they make it go up. So, does that clear up your question?

Councilmember Hoy: It clears up my question, but it does not give me time to do the math on it but it looks like they are fairly close in line with those figures.

Cheryl Musgrave: Now, if you look underneath.

Paul Hatfield: No, they are not.

Councilmember Hoy: They are not?

Paul Hatfield: No, I tell you what.

Cheryl Musgrave: Mr. Hoy, if you look underneath that, if you are wanting to do the math you have the cost per parcel. You can see that kind of jumps up and down. There are of course certain economies on scale that you get a larger township that can do more parcels more cheaply just because they are bigger and then when you get to a very small township like Union you have to have certain things to get the job done but the number of parcels is low and so it drives that bottom line up a little. But you need to reflect upon those numbers and just come to your own conclusion.

Councilmember Hoy: Thank you. Because when you come in here as a Council person and this is sitting on your desk we do not have time to digest everything that is on this sheet and the, I know that you all don't like this kind of session, but it is also our job to look this over and to make sure. You have already mentioned that the Extra Help for Scott is too much but there is $15.70 compared to Center which looks to be the lowest at $3.80. So, naturally I do wonder why there is, well I know why there is that wide of a variation because that figure is wrong in there. In Scott, that is a no-brainer, all I want to do, and I don't want to pick this thing to pieces, Mr. Wortman, but it just seems that it would be an easy thing to change from 25 to ten without wrecking the whole budget for everybody else, that is not a big deal and bring that more in line. But, I see a great variation there and if you could shed some light on it, I would appreciate it.

Paul Hatfied: Well, first of all.

Councilmember Wortman: Paul, excuse me but we are going to change tapes right quick.

Tape Change

Paul Hatfield: The parcels that are shown for Knight is just damn near 3,000 low. He is very close if not there at 26,000.

Al Folz: That's a year...a year and so ago when those things came out.

Paul Hatfield: Yeah. Now, in my case Cheryl is showing 17,375. We're now actually close to a little over 19. You might ask, why is that? Well, I'll tell you why. It's because there has been a lot of parcels in my township that were never taxed. We've caught them. We have put on a tremendous effort to check, to check, to check. We have an ongoing inspection program. So, I mean, the main thing is just remember a budget is not spending the money. You know what, as far as I'm concerned, yes, I'll say it right out loud: Center is too low. She's got 13,000 parcels. I don't know what your problem is. I know this, we've been in here now about 35 minutes. We should have been out of here ten minutes ago. It's--

Councilmember Raben: Paul, let me--

Paul Hatfield: Let me say this to you guys. You're talking about you've got time to work to look these over, well, by God you're going to have to take time. Now today is not the time to peruse this and question them. You should have been questioning us long before now or last week in our offices. You would have a lot of information that you didn't have when you came in here. 

Councilmember Hoy: I just found this on my desk today.

Councilmember Raben: Let me raise one question. Again, this is a five month budget. 

Paul Hatfield: Yeah.

Councilmember Raben: Yours is $135,000.

Paul Hatfield: No, $107,000, I beg your pardon.

Councilmember Raben: Oh, I'm sorry, excuse me.

Paul Hatfield: Yeah.

Councilmember Raben: It's $107,000. What would you speculate would be an 18 month budget? I mean, if we're going to spend $107,000 in five months.

Paul Hatfield: Probably next year's budget probably a couple of hundred.

Councilmember Raben: Okay, because that's what you have is $215,650 as a request. 

Paul Hatfield: When next year?

Councilmember Raben: For 2000, yes.

Paul Hatfield: Yeah, you're right. 

Councilmember Raben: Which would be roughly $320--

Paul Hatfield: Now, let me stop you. Just remember this budget we will...it's an ongoing thing with me. At the end of this year or before August I'll be able to gauge what we're going to have or what we're going to encumber. Now you might save a lot of money on that $215,000. Part of next year's spending is right here. We may not spend it all. It's a budget. It's not expenditure. 

Councilmember Sutton: Mr. President.

Councilmember Raben: I'm going to speak on my behalf and only my behalf. I understand what you're saying. I never said you don't do a great job because I really feel like it's as if you do, but this isn't the only meeting we're going to have. From my perspective, I don't feel comfortable--

Paul Hatfield: Jim, with all due respect to you I've only got one big concern. I've got to have people ready to go on the payroll August 23rd, period.

Councilmember Raben: Okay, and with some adjustments to this--

Paul Hatfield: Because you don't realize how much time it's going to take--

Councilmember Raben: --we can still do that.

Paul Hatfield: --to inspect this number of properties.

Councilmember Raben: With some adjustments to these I think we could do just that and still be comfortable for the next 60 days.

Paul Hatfield: Well, I'll tell you what you do. I'm kind of tired of fooling with this stuff. Give me a buck and I'll see how far I can make it go. I don't care what the hell you do.

Councilmember Hoy: I would ask from all of you...it bothers me that we are in a public meeting, and I'm not saying this to you, but as Council people we are sitting here and I feel like we're asking proper questions and we've been respectful. I give respect to officeholders and I expect it back and I would like to have a little more decorum in this meeting simply because I think we are here to deal with this as adult people, you know, and as people who will reason with each other. I just resent those kinds of outbursts. Thank you, sir. 

Councilmember Sutton: There is a, Mr. President, there is a motion on the floor and it has been seconded. I don't know, Mr. Raben, if you are intending to ask the maker of the motion to accept an amendment to the motion. If so, I think it might be appropriate. If not, then I will call for the question.

Councilmember Raben: What I would like to ask the maker, if the maker would accept, is that we defer this until Wednesday. 

Councilmember Sutton: But we have a motion on the floor. 

President Wortman: No, you've got to have...it's too late to advertise it. You can't do it. 

Councilmember Sutton: We have a motion on the floor.

President Wortman: So we've got a motion on the floor, as Mr. Sutton said, and a second. If there is no other discussion Im going to call for a vote. Call the roll call vote please.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Smith?

Councilmember Smith: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Sutton?

Councilmember Sutton: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilman Bassemier?

Councilman Bassemier: I just want one question. That Scott, now is that staying to $25,000 or is that going back to $10,000? 

President Wortman: Well, they're not going to spend it. I called them this morning and they're going to be comfortable with it. They promised me they wouldn't spend it, so that's as good as that. It was my mistake I left it in there. It was an oversight, but they're not going to spend it, okay? 

Councilman Bassemier: Okay, I'll have to take their word for it.

President Wortman: Yeah, that's right.

Councilman Bassemier: I'm going to vote yes. We need to get this on the road.

President Wortman: That's right, thank you. Mr. Hoy.

Councilmember Hoy: No.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Raben?

Councilmember Raben: No, and I would ask the last two to also vote no. I think, again, you're dealing with a half million dollars here. What in the heck is two more days? I think a lot of these are more than far-fetched. I think they're asking for blue sky and, you know, I don't think that we're acting as we should if we vote in favor of this today, so my vote is no and that's that.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Lloyd?

Councilmember Lloyd: I vote no.

Teri Lukeman: President Wortman?

President Wortman: Yes. Okay. 

(Motion fails 4-3/Councilmembers Hoy, Raben and Lloyd opposed)

Suzanne Crouch: What about the salaries? 

President Wortman: It takes five votes. 

Jeff Ahlers: So it is defeated because it didn't get five votes because you've got salaries in here.

President Wortman: Yeah, yeah.

Jeff Ahlers: So I don't know if you guys want to make another motion or what you're going to do.

Councilmember Lloyd: Can we go department by department? 

Councilmember Hoy: You can bring it back to the floor with a two/thirds vote and make some amendments and pass those parts today. That's legal.

Councilmember Raben: Or we can advertise today...we can call another special meeting within 48 hours.

President Wortman: That's what the meeting was called for now, for a special meeting.

Councilmember Smith: Mr. Chairman, I make the motion that we bring it back to the floor and vote on it if it takes two/thirds of the vote or whatever and go ahead and let's get it finished today.

Councilman Bassemier: I'll second that.

President Wortman: Alright.

Jeff Ahlers: What are we doing?

President Wortman: She made a motion to bring it back on the floor and seconded by Mr. Sutton. Any discussion on that? 

Councilmember Hoy: Mr. Bassemier seconded it.

Councilman Bassemier: I seconded it.

President Wortman: Ed seconded it. Okay, I'm sorry. Any discussion on that?

Councilmember Hoy: So the vote now is to bring this back to the floor, correct? And you need two/thirds.

President Wortman: Right, okay. All those in favor raise your right hand. One, two, three, four, five, six, seven. Okay, now I'll entertain a motion.

Councilmember Raben: Mr. President, I can call some figures. I'll make motions. Again, I would rather have time to work on this over the next day and a half, but I would like to call the County Assessor up. I hate to bring her into the hot seat. I had raised the question earlier about training. Can we have an organized effort on bringing training in to this facility?

Cheryl Musgrave: Yes.

Councilmember Raben: And could you give me an amount on what to appropriate.

Paul Hatfield: What kind of training and on what basis? On the manual? 

Cheryl Musgrave: Whatever you would want.

Paul Hatfield: Well, that's the manual. That's what you have to train them is the manual.

Cheryl Musgrave: Tammy, how much do we have right now, five? I would need a minimum of another $5,000, I believe, to bring in the classes that I believe we could all agree upon needing. 

Glen Koob: We're going to Louisville to ProVal in September. They can't bring it to Evansville, not all of it.

Cheryl Musgrave: That's on the understanding that the travel and per diem and hotel for certain conferences that they're discussing comes out of the Commissioners' budget. Alright, this $5,000 that I'm discussing would be solely to pay for IAAO instructors to come here to do different classes than the one you're talking about now. Okay? 

President Wortman: Mrs. Smith.

Councilmember Smith: Mr. Chairman, she said it would come out of the Commissioners' budget. Whatever has been spent or to be spent on this reassessment shouldn't come out of the Commissioners, it's coming out of the reassessment budget. 

Cheryl Musgrave: I'm more than happy for you guys to have the Commissioners make an appropriation out the Reassessment Fund to pay that travel, but traditionally the travel and per diem and hotel comes out of the Commissioners' budget. 

Glen Koob: It does for everything I've ever--

Councilmember Raben: Let me--

President Wortman: I think reassessment should come out of...the travel should come out of the reassessment budget.

Councilmember Raben: Do you have a line item in your current budget?

Cheryl Musgrave: For?

Councilmember Raben: Training.

Cheryl Musgrave: Yes.

Councilmember Raben: In reassessment?

Cheryl Musgrave: I do.

Councilmember Raben: There may not be any money in it, I haven't looked.

Cheryl Musgrave: There is about $5,000. We've committed some of it to certain classes.

Councilmember Raben: Okay, so we can make an appropriation into that account.

Cheryl Musgrave: And we're counting on another $5,000.

Councilmember Raben: We can make an appropriation into that account, so we would need to make an appropriation for $5,000 into that account?

Cheryl Musgrave: Yes, sir.

Councilmember Raben: Okay, unless somebody else wants to throw out figures I'm going to roll with it. This is crude because I'm not prepared to do this today, but I would move down to Center Assessor--

Councilmember Sutton: Mr. Raben, before you start reeling off numbers.

President Wortman: Just a minute, hold up.

Councilmember Sutton: Before you start reeling off numbers, Mr. Raben, I think you had indicated that you had not met or discussed this with them prior to this meeting that we're having here today, exception of the meeting. Now I guess before you begin to do that I guess I maybe want to get an idea, the basis maybe for the numbers before we maybe get into the numbers. I mean, obviously we've got one set of numbers here. Is this based upon what you feel is appropriate for them or is this based upon...just trying to get an idea here. 

Councilmember Raben: This is...I'm just trying to get something in place for the next 30 or 60 days.

Councilman Bassemier: Mr. President.

Councilmember Raben: So they can hire their people. We still don't know the number of man hours, we don't know the number of personnel. You know, we don't have that information.

Councilmember Sutton: I guess what my point is if there is some key pieces of information that you would like to have and then we're saying that we want to set in numbers arent we doing the same thing that was just voted down? Were setting in numbers without really having a true sense of what those numbers represent. So if there is something specific, items that you feel this Council is overlooking my suggestion is that you would clearly outline what those issues are to each of the areas, each of the Assessors here, and say, you know, these are my concerns and I would like you to answer these concerns in terms of how these monies will be spent for line item X, line item and on down the line so that if we're talking about really making a sensible budget here that we can then go back and say, okay, this is based upon what we feel is appropriate for this office rather than arbitrarily putting in some figures that maybe we feel are best since none of us are going to do the reassessment.

Councilmember Smith: Mr. President.

President Wortman: Yes.

Councilmember Smith: Did you say that you were going to put $5,000 in the County Assessor's budget for training? What if the other Township Assessors want to train their own their way? I mean, are they committed then to having it all done there?

Councilmember Raben: I tell you what, I would leave that to Glen. I know she organized the training the last time and it probably went very smooth.

Glen Koob: Yes, but it...it did go very smooth, but it's a different type training this time.

Councilmember Smith: Come to the mike, Glen. Okay, they're elected to do the assessing and Glen might have a way that she wants to train hers.

Glen Koob: Right.

Councilmember Smith: They might each one want to train them different, so I don't understand why you would want to take one figure and put it--

Glen Koob: Well, the reason why I don't disagree with putting that figure in one lump sum, the IAAO money, because that comes out of all one account and there is like 23 of us or 30 of us that go. That's one way to train and it's something like critique mass appraisal, depreciation, they way they--

Councilmember Smith: But is there other training that has to be done besides?

Glen Koob: Yes. We're going to, for instance, you were talking...Cheryl was talking about ProVal a while ago. That's our software company. That's our software system that we put all of our data into. It's priced and that's how we price out. We draw our photographs in there. Okay, they are having a school to tell us and teach us different things in September for four days. So that's what we kind of want to know. We usually send it to the Commissioners. The Commissioners okay that travel and then they pay our per diem, our hotel and our mileage out of that.

Councilmember Smith: Right.

Glen Koob: So, you know, if you want that to come out of reassessment that all can't go into the County Assessor's budget because she is going to be broke by I don't know. If you figure there is--

Councilmember Smith: My point was before we do that we might have to think what each one of the Assessors wants to do.

Glen Koob: Right. I mean, it's commendable that the County Assessor puts that money in her budget and trains and calls up this IAAO and brings these classes down to Evansville because it saves money for Vanderburgh County for all of us traveling out of town, okay. So it's good that we have that. So, yes, she needs money in hers to have IAAO classes. I think she has two of them set up, our a one week one. We have to test those things. She has one week and then she has a couple of day training sessions set up. It costs $315 or $320 a person to go to those things, plus the books. Last time she bought the books to go with. So, yes, she needs that money in there for that, but we also need money someplace else. 

Councilmember Smith: That was my question.

Glen Koob: For each individual Assessor's office to go to this to learn how to do our software because it's going to be different and to learn different technics and ways to do it. Because you've got to understand, Jim, they're reassessing totally different. By reassessing I mean figuring it. They're not going to cut it into a third anymore. It's going to go to 100 percent of the value. Last time if it was, for an easy one, if it was a $10,000 assessment it's going to be a $30,000 assessment because we just have different ways of doing it and the state and the legislature has put on us, look, you Assessors with Level II, all Level II people, and I've got three Level II people in my office, or four including me, and two Level I, they all have to, the Level II, have to have 45 hours of training in two year's time. So, I mean, we're going to have to get the money someplace and we have to travel to Vincennes to do that, to get that training from the state. That's just part of it. We have to travel to Louisville to get it for our software. The IAAO is coming down here. We just had a conference over at the Executive Inn. They brought in IAAO and trained us for $60 a person for a seven hour class. Yeah, it's expensive and, yes, she needs some money in hers, but, yes, we also need some unless you're going to send up the General Fund and give the Commissioners some money out of the Reassessment Fund to pay our training. I dont know how you're going to do it, but I just know that we need it.

Councilmember Smith: That was my question because I know there is certain things and if Cheryl could train all of you at one time for some things, but you're still going to have to have some training money in the other with all the changes.

Glen Koob: Yeah, and I don't know how you're going to do it.

President Wortman: Well, I want to tell the Council I met with all the Assessors two and three times and we all set down individually and we had them to a meeting and for somebody to come in here and pick it apart that don't know what they're doing it kind of bothers me. This is a good example on the training. Now if they understood that they would have went down there like I did. I spent a lot of time.

Glen Koob: Yeah.

President Wortman: And you know it. I went around to all the Assessors and they had the same opportunity that I did. This is what bothers me is to pick something apart that you don't and we worked hard at it. Like I said, it may be some accounts are under funded and over funded, but there have been reasons and we had no direction from the state. That was one thing that is wrong, the Assessors here, so you can't blame them and we're in disarray a little bit, but they've got to get to going here and this delay stuff is just going to postpone it and then we're going to get in a mess and then we'll say, well, I don't know.

Councilmember Hoy: Mr. President.

President Wortman: Yes.

Councilmember Hoy: You were the only Councilmember that met with all the Assessors, is that correct? 

Glen Koob: No.

President Wortman: No, I didn't say that I did. Some of them didn't. Everybody had an opportunity like I did, Mr. Hoy.

Glen Koob: You and Betty.

Councilmember Raben: Here at the meeting, what was it a week ago Thursday? 

Councilmember Hoy: The hearing.

Councilmember Raben: The hearing, right.

Councilmember Hoy: But the preparation for that meeting was done how?

President Wortman: I went around and talked to all the Assessors individually. I just kind of went over their budget and everybody else had the opportunity. You probably did too, didn't you, to meet with them?

Councilmember Hoy: Usually, with all due respect to you, Mr. Wortman, you expect the President to lead and to bring together perhaps a committee from the Council and do something like that. I think it would be ill-advised for each one of us to do our own putting together the budget and that seems to be a very clumsy way to do it. I have a question on the training, what differences are there?

Glen Koob: In the training?

Councilmember Hoy: Well, I mean what would be different in German Township from what you would do?

Glen Koob: Since it is all new, nothing. 

Councilmember Hoy: That's what I mean. It's the same state, it's the same county, it's the same system.

Glen Koob: Right, right. 

Councilmember Hoy: Is there not some way, you know, to bring, it would seem to me, bring all that together for the whole county would just make sense.

Glen Koob: Well, that's what Ms. Musgrave is doing with the IAAO training. The training for the software is all in Louisville, Kentucky.

Councilmember Hoy: But that is...do you all use the same software? 

Glen Koob: Yes. 

Councilmember Hoy: So that could be brought together as well?

Glen Koob: Well, that's where the training is, is in Louisville, Kentucky.

Cheryl Musgrave: May I?

Glen Koob: I have to tell Jim one thing first. 

Cheryl Musgrave: Okay.

Glen Koob: And then you can have it all by yourself.

Councilmember Hoy: What I didn't understand about the training is Mrs. Smith said, well, each one is different. I can't understand how each township could be different.

Glen Koob: No, she meant each one needs different...each one needs money for different training sessions like, okay, say for instance when we're going to Louisville, Kentucky--

Councilmember Hoy: That I understand what you're saying. So you're fine.

Glen Koob: I'm sure Mrs. Musgrave is not going to want to pay all of us out her reassessment account for us all going to Louisville because she won't have enough.

Councilmember Hoy: But we're talking about standardized training, the same training for everyone?

Glen Koob: Yeah. Yes.

Paul Hatfield: No it is not. No, it is not! IAAO training is on--

Glen Koob: He means don't everybody get the same training, Paul. You misunderstood the question.

Paul Hatfield: Yeah, you're right. We're talking about reassessment is based on reproduction costs, IAAO training is on market, market. We're not on market. Now as far as training goes we have it in there for the various reasons that she just expounded. When it comes down to training the inspectors I'm going to do it. I'm responsible for assessing a property in Pigeon. Nobody else. You guys are making a--

Councilmember Hoy: But you still use the same standard of training for each township. That's the only point I am making.

Paul Hatfield: But training on what basis? Market, that's the IAAO. 

Councilmember Hoy: I understand that, but what I am saying is that we have the same state laws that apply to every county and every township.

Paul Hatfield: I understand that. 

Councilmember Hoy: That's the only point Im making is a while ago I did not understand why each township would be doing different kinds of training since you're going to follow the same standards.

Paul Hatfield: They're talking about one thing and I am talking about another. I'm talking about training on the manual that which we will receive based on reproduction costs.

Councilmember Hoy: Well, Mrs. Koob made it real clear to me and I understand what she is saying. I'm not confused about that any more and would like to move to another point.

Councilmember Lloyd: Mr. President.

Paul Hatfield: I think that's good. 

A) ARMSTRONG TOWNSHIP ASSESSOR/REASSESSMENT

Councilmember Lloyd: I would like to make a motion to approve Armstrong Township Assessor Reassessment Fund $8,890 as submitted.

Councilman Bassemier: I'll second that. 

President Wortman: Okay, we've got a motion on the floor for Armstrong as $8,890. Alright, any discussion on that? Call the roll please.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Smith?

Councilmember Smith: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Sutton?

Councilmember Sutton: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilman Bassemier?

Councilman Bassemier: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Hoy?

Councilmember Hoy: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Raben?

Councilmember Raben: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Lloyd?

Councilmember Lloyd: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: President Wortman?

President Wortman: Yes.

ARMSTRONG TWP. ASSESSOR REQUESTED APPROVED
 

(Motion unanimously approved 7-0)

B) CENTER TOWNSHIP ASSESSOR/REASSESSMENT

President Wortman: Okay, now I'll take a motion on Center Township, next in line. 

Councilman Bassemier: I make a motion to approve Center Township.

Councilmember Smith: Second.

President Wortman: We've got a motion and a second. Any discussion? That is for $51,490. 

Councilmember Raben: Let's go back to training, to the training issue again. If we leave a figure lesser than $3,000 in there and we're going to use either monies from the Commissioners' budget or from the Assessor's budget do we leave $3,000 in place?

Cheryl Musgrave: This is the point I've been wanting to make.

Glen Koob: Oh, your turn.

Cheryl Musgrave: Thank you. The numbers that don't exist on this spreadsheet are the ones that you've been trying to insert all along and that there has been some stated confusion on. Mrs. Smith, they do have some money in their budgets already that was appropriated last year for this year to meet some of these costs. So that's the point that I wanted to make. Even if you zero out, and I am not suggesting this, even if you did they would still have some money that you gave them for this year already.

Councilmember Raben: See, currently under Center they have $3,000 in training that was budgeted last year for `99. So if we grant another $3,000 we're giving them $6,000 to use over the next five months. 

Rebecca Galey: Rebecca Galey, Chief Deputy, Center Township Assessors Office. I do not have $3,000 left. That money that is in Reassessment Training I have had to use because you took out, deleted my General Fund Training, so I am using that for all the training that we have to have and we've had several sessions. So we're using our Reassessment for General instead. So I have to have that money. We just spent $2,000 for registration for ProVal. ProVal is not just reassessment. It is every year ongoing we have to have those classes every single year. Registration, $2000. It has to come out of our budget.

Councilmember Raben: Okay, Rebecca, you also have a request for an Office Coordinator and a Field Coordinator. Last year we put in place Land Coordinators, correct?

Rebecca Galey: Right.

Councilmember Raben: So back to the extra help. Given those two individuals yet you still have a request for $15,000 Extra Help for five months.

Rebecca Galey: Right.

Councilmember Raben: Would $10,000 be appropriate? 

Rebecca Galey: This is what it was suggested by those at the meeting for me to have for Extra Help plus the coordinators. It was suggested that that's what I needed.

Councilmember Raben: What do you need?

Rebecca Galey: $15,000.

President Wortman: You were there, Jim.

Rebecca Galey: You were there. You were also the one that suggested it because I didn't have any Extra Help in there and you were the one who suggested that I needed $15,000 and that's for four people which isn't quite enough. We have 13,500. We expand. We go way, way out, so we've got a lot of traveling to do, but this was the way my budget was set up by the suggestions of that meeting. 

Councilmember Bassemier: What do you think, Jim, did you change your mind?

Councilmember Raben: I don't care. We can give them...there is a million six, let's give them a million six today and be done with it. I mean, I don't care take the vote. I'll go on to the next one. 

President Wortman: Alright, anymore discussion, Mrs. Smith? Call for a vote please. 

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Smith?

Councilmember Smith: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Sutton?

Councilmember Sutton: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilman Bassemier?

Councilman Bassemier: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Hoy?

Councilmember Hoy: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Raben?

Councilmember Raben: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Lloyd?

Councilmember Lloyd: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: President Wortman?

President Wortman: Yes.

CENTER TWP. ASSESSOR REQUESTED APPROVED
 

(TABLE CONTINUED NEXT PAGE)
 

(Motion unanimously approved 7-0)

C) GERMAN TOWNSHIP ASSESSOR/REASSESSMENT

President Wortman: Okay, we'll go into German Township.

Councilmember Raben: I move that we approve this as submitted.

President Wortman: $16,426, do I have a second?

Councilmember Smith: Second.

President Wortman: Mrs. Smith second. Any discussion? No discussion. Call the roll.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Smith?

Councilmember Smith: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Sutton?

Councilmember Sutton: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilman Bassemier?

Councilman Bassemier: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Hoy?

Councilmember Hoy: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Raben?

Councilmember Raben: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Lloyd?

Councilmember Lloyd: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: President Wortman?

President Wortman: Yes.

GERMAN TWP. ASSESSOR REQUESTED APPROVED
 

(TABLE CONTINUED NEXT PAGE)
 

(Motion unanimously approved 7-0)

D) KNIGHT TOWNSHIP ASSESSOR/REASSESSMENT

President Wortman: Knight Township.

Councilmember Raben: Okay, Mr. President, I have a question. Al, of that $56,000 how many people is that?

Al Folz: Eight.

Councilmember Raben: Eight.

Al Folz: We're paying $8.50 an hour. 

Councilmember Raben: Okay.

Al Folz: To be able to get them started, get them out there.

Councilmember Raben: Okay, now who supervises those individuals?

Al Folz: There is a Field Coordinator and myself. Again, just like the rest of them it's on our back. We're the one entirely responsible so I'm out in the field, but you also have a Field Coordinator because he has to schedule where each group goes. Everybody is out there, so he has got to schedule that in the morning or that evening so that they have it in the mornings where they know exactly which subdivision they're going to be in.

Councilmember Raben: How many hours is that figured on?

Al Folz: I believe that...Mr. Wortman figured it for all of us and you was sitting there, what did he do? 

President Wortman: Yeah, I think it was 153 days at eight hours a day at 1,224 hours times $8.50.

Al Folz: Yes, sir.

Councilmember Raben: Okay, now these individuals, I mean, bad weather. What do they do during bad weather?

Al Folz: They work. They've got umbrellas, they've got rain jackets. They did it the last three reassessments. Why aren't they going to do it this time? I mean, you know, we're not new at this.

Councilmember Raben: Okay.

Al Folz: They're out there.

Councilmember Raben: Mr. President, I would like to throw a figure out, okay. Again, we can come back and address this issue in November. We can come back in December.

President Wortman: Now when you say throw a figure out is this just a guess or what are you basing it on?

Al Folz: Yeah.

Councilmember Raben: This is a guess, that's exactly right. 

President Wortman: I don't like guesses myself, I like facts.

Councilmember Raben: Okay, then let me address another issue. Back to travel and mileage.

Al Folz: Okay.

Councilmember Raben: Based on that, that's over 17,800 miles.

Al Folz: We said 17,000 just a little bit ago.

Councilmember Raben: Those aren't going to be real?

Al Folz: Well, if not I can't spend it. I mean, Ive got to be able to pay this out. If not, all I've got--

Councilmember Smith: Take that at 284 a mile.

Councilmember Raben: Divide that into $5,000. It's 17,800 and some odd miles. I gave that figure earlier.

Councilmember Smith: But if they don't use it and they don't put in for their mileage then it is going to be left in the budget.

Al Folz: Why sure that's the only thing I can use it for. 

Councilmember Raben: Training, we're back to that issue again.

Al Folz: Yes.

Councilmember Raben: Dues and Subscriptions. For those of you that weren't at that meeting let me explain what that is. That is a manual that is $435 a manual. A lot of the townships have maybe purchased one. Some of them, from what I understood, did not even purchase any. They ran copies of the other manuals.

Councilmember Smith: I don't think they purchased any. None of them have one yet because it hasn't come out.

Councilmember Raben: Okay, their intent is to run copies. Now I do know that there is some township offices that have ran copies of this manual already.

Councilmember Smith: Jim, that manual is not out. The state hasn't sent it out yet and Glen said when she got it she could make copies of it.

Councilmember Raben: It is available. 

Glen Koob: Yeah, it is. Marshall &--

Paul Hatfield: No, it's not.

Glen Koob: Yes, it is.

Councilmember Smith: Oh, I thought you said--

Councilmember Raben: It is too. We've had this discussion.

Glen Koob: Marshall & Swift now--

Councilmember Hoy: Would you come to the mike?

Glen Koob: Oh, I'm sorry.

Councilmember Raben: Now this request is for ten manuals.

Councilmember Smith: That's too many.

Glen Koob: Okay Marshall & Swift presently make a manual but they're going to make a manual especially for Indiana that is not out yet. Some of the Assessors apply to the Marshall & Swift service where they get updated sheets every so often whenever they change a pricing in that manual, so, yes there is presently a Marshall & Swift service, but, no, we don't have the Marshall & Swift manual from Indiana yet. 

Councilmember Smith: Glen said she needed one and she could make copies, but--

Glen Koob: Betty, don't say that out loud, I don't know if they've got some kind of copyright law or whatever. The attorney is here. The attorney is here, Betty.

Councilmember Smith: But Curt agreed to let the county or someone buy them all and then split them up. Buy all at once.

Glen Koob: I don't care. You can put it all in one fund because let me say this, it said on that paper that I gave...Jim was asking me that day how much they cost and it said on that paper that if they get so many purchases of this manual you may, you may, get a $140 rebate. If the state gets so many orders they may at Marshall & Swift may give them a $140 rebate. I don't know if that means per manual because they are $435 a piece. That's for a set of residential and commercial and weve never had to do this before, never. The state always made...went through Purdue or whoever or Sabre & Company and made these manuals up and gave them to us.

President Wortman: Now, Mr.--

Glen Koob: When he comes to me can I tell you something about my part-time, my help?

Councilmember Raben: Yes.

President Wortman: Let me ask Mrs. Musgrave to come the microphone just a minute. 

Cheryl Musgrave: Hello.

President Wortman: You and I and Mr. McIntyre of the State Tax Board talked and what was he saying about running copies, it wouldn't infringe on the patent, if it's a possibility.

Cheryl Musgrave: Okay, each hard copy of the manual comes with a CD-Rom and a CD-Rom license as far as, gosh, Mr. McIntyre understood, allows you to print off the page. It's no infringement upon the copyright to print this page one time, ten times, whatever. His suggestion to us, and he is a State Tax Board Commissioner, is that we buy one copy of the manual, take the disk per office and then print off the pages, you might need them all, for the rest of the folks in your office, no matter how many times you might need them. 

President Wortman: We're still not going to order any books. I think everybody, Mr. Hatfield and Al Folz all agreed to it, and Glen, until we find out where we're at and then we can order one time. It depends on the books or the copies on what we're going to do, so I hope that explains it.

Councilmember Raben: Mr. Wortman, do we treat any other budget this way though? In August when we do budgets and there are requests for $30,000 and we say you only need $10,000 do we accept when they, well, if I don't spend it I'll bring it back? No, we don't treat any budget like that. We never have, not while I have been on this Council. So if there are adjustments to be made we need to make them today. I mean, we've never done that in this room before and I just I'm not comfortable with giving...I don't care if it's the Pope up there. If he asks for more than I think he needs I wouldn't give it to him.

President Wortman: You would be excommunicated then, probably.

Councilmember Raben: I probably would. I let the--

Councilmember Hoy: That's okay, Jim, we would accept you in the United Church.

Councilmember Raben: I let the local Bishop have it.

Al Folz: What about a Cardinal?

Councilmember Raben: Well, I let the local Bishop have it at a City Council meeting one night that I attended. But I think adjustments can be made to this budget. I think $35,000 would be a lot of money in Extra Help to get them up and running. In 60 or 90 days if they need more money we can address it then. Office Supplies, I think $3,000 is a lot for a five month budget. Back to Travel and Mileage, I know damn good and well that they're not going to travel almost 18,000 miles in that township. Training we have already had that until we're blue in the face. Okay, Extra Help $35,000; Office Supplies $1,000; Travel and Mileage $2,500; Training $1,000; Dues and Subscriptions $435. That would be my motion. All others as listed except for Unemployment zero.

Councilmember Hoy: Could...do you have that down so you can read that back?

Councilmember Raben: No, no.

Teri Lukeman: Me?

Councilmember Hoy: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Do you want the line numbers or just the...?

Councilmember Hoy: Yeah, please.

Teri Lukeman: Twenty-four...I'm sorry.

Councilmember Raben: Unemployment zero; Extra Help $35,000; Office Supplies $1,000; Travel and Mileage $2,500; Training $1,000; Dues and Subscriptions $435.

Councilmember Hoy: Everything else the same?

Councilmember Raben: Everything else the same?

Councilmember Hoy: And that's a motion?

Councilmember Raben: That's a motion?

Al Folz: How can we buy manuals on...may I say something?

Councilmember Hoy: We need to get a motion on the floor first, sir.

Al Folz: Okay.

President Wortman: You've done made the motion, Jim.

Councilmember Hoy: You need a second to get it on the floor.

Councilmember Lloyd: I'll second.

President Wortman: You second it.

Al Folz: Looking at Dues and Subscriptions, $435. We can't buy anything.

Councilmember Raben: That was the figure given to us was $435 for a manual.

Al Folz: There is two different manuals. There is one also I think for industrial/commercial and also for residential.

Cheryl Musgrave: It's the same.

Councilmember Raben: It was our understanding--

Councilmember Hoy: It's a set.

Al Folz: So we get a set for $435? But you know, only one manual for my office?

Councilmember Raben: Well, you didn't listen to the prior explanation.

Al Folz: I've heard about it, I heard you. But that's it? One manual for that?

Councilmember Hoy: Mrs. Musgrave said that comes on a disk and--

Glen Koob: That disk is separate.

Cheryl Musgrave: No, it comes with it.

Councilmember Hoy: The disk comes with the manual and off of the disk you can make copies without infringing on copyright?

Cheryl Musgrave: Correct.

Al Folz: Well, who is going to do this? Who is going to do this?

Councilmember Raben: Your staff.

Al Folz: What do you mean, my staff? I don't have enough people now. What about your staff? 

President Wortman: Okay, Mr. Bassemier, you have something? 

Councilman Bassemier: Yeah, this is to everybody, I guess. I've been Al's liaison officer for seven years now and he has never asked for anything he didn't need and you're cutting him. I'm not going to embarrass him up here. I'm going to vote no on it, I'm just saying that right now. Al says he needs, I'm going to vote this down, so I just want that on record.

President Wortman: Yeah, okay I feel the same way. Okay, got a motion on the floor. Any other discussion? If not, call for the vote.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Smith?

Councilmember Smith: No.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Sutton?

Councilmember Sutton: No.

Teri Lukeman: Councilman Bassemier?

Councilman Bassemier: No.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Hoy?

Councilmember Hoy: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Raben?

Councilmember Raben: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Lloyd?

Councilmember Lloyd: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: President Wortman?

President Wortman: No. Motion defeated. 

(Motion fails 3-4/Councilmembers Smith, Sutton, Bassemier and Wortman opposed)

(Tape Change)

Councilmember Hoy: I move we bring the Knight Township Assessor's budget back up for reconsideration.

Councilmember Smith: Second.

President Wortman: Motion and a second, Mrs. Smith. Any discussion on that to move it up for consideration? Okay, all those in favor, raise your right hand. One, two, three, four, five, six, seven. Okay proceed, Mr. --

Councilmember Hoy: I'd like to make a motion that we approve the entire Knight Township Assessor's budget with the exception of Unemployment and I would place that at zero, Extra help at $35,000, Office Supplies at $1,500, Travel and Mileage at $3,000 and Dues & Subscriptions at $1,500. 

Councilmember Sutton: One more time, Councilman.

Councilmember Hoy: Training I put at...I believe I put that at $2,500 instead of a thousand.

President Wortman: Would you repeat that, Mr. Hoy?

Councilmember Sutton: And Extra Help $35,000?

Councilmember Hoy: Yes, I will repeat that. Unemployment at zero, Extra Help at $35,000, Office Supplies at $1,500, Travel/Mileage at $2,500, Training at $2,500 and Dues & Subscriptions at $1,500, which would allow for three of those training books.

Councilmember Sutton: Second.

President Wortman: Got a motion and a second on the floor. Any discussion on this? 

Councilmember Sutton: Outside of the fact that for $435, they can have a thousand copies if they want, so --

Councilmember Hoy: I just want to give them a head start, Jim. 

Councilmember Raben: Yeah.

President Wortman: Any more discussion? If not, call the roll.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Smith?

Councilmember Smith: I'm going to vote no because I don't think Al would spend any money that isn't necessary to be spent and I feel like they need to move on it and I am going to vote no because I think it should be left as it is.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Sutton?

Councilmember Sutton: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Bassemier?

Councilmember Bassemier: No.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Hoy?

Councilmember Hoy: Before I vote yes, my motion I hope is not construed to mean that I don't trust the Knight Assessor. I do, I just think this is more realistic and I vote yes. 

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Raben?

Councilmember Raben: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Lloyd?

Councilmember Lloyd: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: President Wortman?

President Wortman: No. You've got to have five votes so it's defeated. 

(Motion fails 4-3/Councilmembers Smith, Bassemier and Wortman opposed)

Jeff Ahlers: It takes five votes because of the salaries. If you want to pull the salaries out you can split that in half. 

Councilmember Hoy: Mr. President, I make a motion to bring up the Knight Township Assessor's budget one more time and it takes a two/thirds vote. 

Councilmember Smith: I second it.

Councilmember Hoy: Mr. President, I make a motion that we approve and that we divide the Knight Township Assessor's budget up and that we, first of all, approve all of the salary section which would go from 2492-1130-1120 down through 2492-1130-1920 Insurance and I move that we approve those as listed.

Jeff Ahlers: Did you include the FICA and everything?

Councilmember Hoy: FICA, that's the whole thing, FICA, PERF and Insurance.

Jeff Ahlers: This will only take a majority, instead of two/thirds.

Councilmember Hoy: No, this is wage -- these are the wages.

Jeff Ahlers: I thought you meant to reopen, it only take a majority.

Councilmember Hoy: To reopen?

Jeff Ahlers: Right, because we didn't -- okay, because we never adopted Robert's Rules and the rules we adopted just call for a majority. I was just going to remind you.

President Wortman: Okay, Mr. Hoy made a motion on 1120, 1140, 1900, 1910 and 1920, stop there on those five items. 

Glen Koob: (Inaudible -- comments not made from microphone)

Councilmember Hoy: That will be another motion.

President Wortman: We stopped at the end of Insurance. Okay, who seconded it?

Councilmember Hoy: Mr. Raben.

President Wortman: Mr. Raben seconded it. Alright, any discussion on that? Call the roll, please. 

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Smith?

Councilmember Smith: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Sutton?

Councilmember Sutton: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Bassemier?

Councilmember Bassemier: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Hoy?

Councilmember Hoy: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Raben?

Councilmember Raben: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Lloyd?

Councilmember Lloyd: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: President Wortman?

President Wortman: No.

(Motion carried 6-1/Councilmember Wortman opposed)

Councilmember Hoy: Mr. President, starting with line 2492-1130-1930 I vote that we pass it in it's entirety except that Unemployment be set in at zero, Extra Help at $35,000, Office Supplies at $1,500, Travel/Mileage at $2,500, Training at $2,500 and Dues & Subscriptions at $1,500. That's my motion. 

Councilmember Raben: And I'll second that motion.

President Wortman: Any discussion?

Al Folz: Can I say something?

President Wortman: Mr. Folz.

(Inaudible -- several Councilmembers speaking at once)

Councilmember Hoy: It was voted down but we took the salaries out because it takes a two/thirds vote.

Jeff Ahlers: You still have Extra Help in there so it's still going to take five.

President Wortman: We got a motion on the floor, now. Mr. Folz?

Al Folz: Yes, I'd like to call your attention again, $35,000 as far as my Extra Help is kind of unrealistic. And what you were saying was, I am just pulling a figure out of the air just because I thought it was too high. We went over this and over this. Mr. Wortman came down to the office three times and we went over and over and over and he brought up some hours, $35,000 is not a realistic figure in being able to do all of the parcels that I have in Knight Township. We have a certain amount of time, a time limit that we have to be done. If I can't do anything and all of a sudden I am out of money, those people quit. That's it, they do not go any further than that. Nobody is going to be able to work with nothing.

Councilmember Sutton: Mr. President, could I ask for a recess for five or ten minutes here?

President Wortman: Yes, sir. Mr. Sutton requested a recess and it's granted to the Councilman.

Councilmember Hoy: You have a motion on the floor, sir. We have a motion on the floor and a second, but we're going to call a recess. 

Councilmember Raben: We have to vote on this motion.

President Wortman: We're going to recess for ten minutes.

Meeting resumed

President Wortman: We've got a motion on the floor. 

Councilmember Hoy: Mr. President, I would like to amend my motion if the seconder will agree with the amendment and take line 2492-1130-1990 Extra Help and make that $40,000. That's the amendment I'd like to place and I don't know who seconded my motion. Will you accept that?

Councilmember Raben: Are all the other figures the same?

Councilmember Hoy: All the other figures are the same.

Councilmember Raben: That you had mentioned earlier?

Councilmember Hoy: Yes.

Councilmember Raben: Okay, I'll second that motion.

Councilmember Smith: Are you, Mr. Chairman, are you saying that the Supplies is still going to be at $1,500? Is that what you're...

Councilmember Hoy: Yes.

Councilmember Smith: Okay, and then $2,500 on the Mileage?

Councilmember Hoy: Yeah, I'll read the whole thing.

Councilmember Smith: Okay.

Councilmember Hoy: That would put Extra Help at $40,000, Office Supplies at $1,500, Travel/Mileage at $2,500, Training at $2,500, Dues &Subscriptions at $1,500, and everything else as it's printed.

President Wortman: Okay, got a motion on the floor and a second. Any more discussion? Call the roll.

Councilmember Raben: Unemployment is zero?

Councilmember Hoy: Yes, Unemployment was zero.

(Inaudible -- several Councilmembers speaking at once)

Councilmember Hoy: Would you like for me to read that back, Mr. President? Mr. President, would you like for me to read that again?

President Wortman: Yeah, one more time.

Councilmember Hoy: Okay, starting with the Unemployment line, that's zero; Extra Help, this is the amended motion, $40,000; Office Supplies $1,500; Color Film $3,000 as it's printed; Travel/Mileage $2,500; Training $2,500; Plat Sheets $8,500; Equipment Repair $2,000; Other Contractual $10,000; Dues & Subscriptions $1,500 and Office Machines $1,000.

Councilmember Raben: And I'll second the motion.

President Wortman: Any other discussion on that?

Councilmember Sutton: Is that doable, I mean workable? What he presented in his motion, Mr. Folz?

Al Folz: Well, we'll try to do the best we can and if it isn't I am just going to have to come back to the Council and request more. I think, again, that the Extra Help is low at $40,000 because we went over this thing with a fine-tooth comb and I think Mr. Wortman and I got in a pretty heated discussion about this thing.

President Wortman: Okay, any other discussion?

Councilmember Hoy: Yes sir. I talked with Mr. Folz and he will know in a timely fashion, too, ahead of one of our meetings if he needs more money and he can come in. I am very concerned that we do not jeopardize the money we voted out of Reassessment for GIS. It's absolutely essential that we protect that money and that's one reason for exercising caution here.

President Wortman: Okay, call the roll please.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Smith?

Councilmember Smith: No.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Sutton?

Councilmember Sutton: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Bassemier?

Councilmember Bassemier: No.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Hoy?

Councilmember Hoy: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Raben?

Councilmember Raben: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Lloyd?

Councilmember Lloyd: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: President Wortman?

President Wortman: No. One, two, three, four.

(Motion fails 4-3/Councilmembers Smith, Bassemier and Wortman opposed)

Councilmember Hoy: You still need five votes for your Extra Help.

Councilmember Raben: Okay, let's make a motion that we set in Extra Help in the amount of $40,000.

Councilmember Hoy: Second.

Councilmember Bassemier: Why don't we make some time and make it $56,000. I think we'll get it passed. 

Councilmember Hoy: Well, I wouldn't count on it.

Councilmember Bassemier: As listed, and we'll save some time. Betty is not going to change her mind, I'm not changing mine and Curt is not going to change his. I am telling you that right now. And now you are starting to piss me off!

Councilmember Hoy: Mr. Bassemier, I have asked for decorum in this body and I think we ought to maintain that.

Councilmember Bassemier: Well, don't test our intelligence.

Councilmember Raben: Well, I tell you what -- again, I am somewhat put out with this. I think, again, there's corrections here that this body needs to make. I think we're being reasonable. --

President Wortman: No, you're speaking for yourself, not for everybody.

Councilmember Raben: We can give them everything they're asking for here, but this body is going to have to be prepared in August to do some chopping on the requests that's in there for next year, so what do you want to do? The only thing is, if you give them everything they're asking for today and they go out and fill the barns up with people and we don't allow them money based on this five month figure in August, that means they're going to have to cut some people, and that is sometimes hard to do. So decide right now what the heck you want to do, but I'll pass the whole darn thing, but everybody needs to understand, in August there's going to have to be some adjustments made to the other budgets.

Councilmember Smith: Then we will face that when we get to it.

President Wortman: Well, like I say, I've been up here for twenty years and I think all these budgets are within reason. I think we've got some good Assessors and they will not overspend and they'll turn the money back in and I think that's a reasonable way to do it. 

Councilmember Raben: Do you want to take the Extra Help and leave it as it is?

Councilmember Hoy: I don't have a motion on the floor now at all.

President Wortman: Because we've got to get out of here in a little bit, so we've got a bunch of others to do here, so..

Councilmember Raben: I had one question. I don't recall, what was Other Contractual? Is there a quick explanation for that?

Al Folz: Oh yes. That's copy machine.

Councilmember Raben: Okay, is that a lease?

Al Folz: No, we buy ours. 

Councilmember Raben: Okay, Mr. President, I am going to move Extra Help be set in at $56,000, all other accounts as listed with the exception of the corrections made on Unemployment, zero; Office Supplies $1,500; Travel/Mileage $2,500; Training $2,500; Dues & Subscriptions $1,500; and I make that in the form of a motion.

Councilmember Sutton: Is that $56,032 or $56,000?

Councilmember Raben: I dont -- $56,032.

Councilmember Sutton: That's a motion.

President Wortman: Who seconded it? Nobody seconded it.

Councilmember Bassemier: I'll go ahead a second it. We've got to, like I said, Al wouldn't be up here if we didn't need it. And I know I've got to bend somewhere. I apologize for getting mad a while ago. I'll go along with that and apologize to you, Mr. Hoy. 

President Wortman: Okay, any other discussion? Call the roll, please.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Smith?

Councilmember Smith: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Sutton?

Councilmember Sutton: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Bassemier?

Councilmember Bassemier: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Hoy?

Councilmember Hoy: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Raben?

Councilmember Raben: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Lloyd?

Councilmember Lloyd: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: President Wortman?

President Wortman: No. Okay, motion passes.

KNIGHT TWP. ASSESSOR REQUESTED APPROVED
 

(TABLE CONTINUED NEXT PAGE)
 

(Motion carried 6-1/Councilmember Wortman opposed)

E) PERRY TOWNSHIP ASSESSOR

President Wortman: Next, Perry Township Assessor.

Councilmember Hoy: I move passage of everything as listed except for Training, Training set in at $1,000 and Dues & Subscriptions set in at $500.

Councilmember Raben: I'll second.

President Wortman: Got a motion and a second. Any discussion on that? Call the roll please.

Councilmember Bassemier: I'm sorry. What was it again?

Councilmember Smith: What was the Training?

Councilmember Raben: $1,000.

President Wortman: Training $1,000, that's 3310, and 3700 Dues & Subscriptions $500. The rest remains as listed. Call the roll please.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Smith?

Councilmember Smith: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Sutton?

Councilmember Sutton: Now what is that figure based on, this Training figure. I mean, I know I see what was presented. How do we get to a thousand?

Councilmember Hoy: I tried to make my motions as equitable as I can, Mr. Sutton, so that they are in relative agreement, all the Assessors are. 

Councilmember Sutton: Thank you. Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Bassemier?

Councilmember Bassemier: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Hoy?

Councilmember Hoy: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Raben?

Councilmember Raben: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Lloyd?

Councilmember Lloyd: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: President Wortman?

President Wortman: No.

PERRY TWP. ASSESSOR REQUESTED APPROVED
 

(Motion carried 6-1/Councilmember Wortman opposed)

F) PIGEON TOWNSHIP ASSESSOR

President Wortman: Next is Pigeon Township Assessor.

Councilmember Raben: Mr. President, Unemployment zero, Office Supplies $2,500, $1,500 on Travel/Mileage, $1,500 on Training --

Paul Hatfield: (Inaudible -- comments not made from the microphone)

Councilmember Raben: We discussed the Training, what we were going to do there.

Councilmember Hoy: Jim, you have the floor. You're a Councilman.

Councilmember Raben: And Mr. President, $2,300 on Dues & Subscriptions.

Councilmember Hoy: Second. 

President Wortman: Got a motion and a second. Any discussion on that? Call the roll please.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Smith?

Councilmember Smith: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Sutton?

Councilmember Sutton: Same question, what are we basing the cut on?

Councilmember Raben: Just trying to keep them --

Councilmember Sutton: Equitable?

Councilmember Raben: Keep them close to the same. And again back to Training, there are funds, I'll look that figure up, unless it's been used on something other than Reassessment Training, there was $2,000 put in this year for Reassessment Training that may be there, may not be, but we did budget for that this year, so there should be $2,000 there in that account right now.

Councilmember Sutton: If there haven't been any expenditures. Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Bassemier?

Councilmember Bassemier: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Hoy?

Councilmember Hoy: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Raben?

Councilmember Raben: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Lloyd?

Councilmember Lloyd: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: President Wortman?

President Wortman: No.

PIGEON TWP. ASSESSOR REQUESTED APPROVED
 

(TABLE CONTINUED NEXT PAGE)
 

(Motion carried 6-1/Councilmember Wortman opposed)

G) SCOTT TOWNSHIP ASSESSOR

President Wortman: Next, Scott Township Assessor.

Councilmember Hoy: Mr. President, on Scott Township, Field Coordinator, FICA, Insurance all as printed, Extra Help $10,000 instead of $25,000, Office Supplies $1,000 instead of $2,000, and Training $1,000 instead of $2,000 and that's my motion. 

Councilmember Raben: I'll second that motion.

President Wortman: We've got a motion and a second on the floor. Any discussion on Scott Township? Mrs. Smith?

Councilmember Smith: You cut that $25,000 down to $1,000 for Extra Help --

Councilmember Hoy: Ten thousand.

Councilmember Smith: I thought you said -- oh, I misunderstood you.

President Wortman: Office Supplies was $1,000.

Councilmember Hoy: Yeah, that's correct.

President Wortman: Okay, any other discussion? Call the roll please.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Smith?

Councilmember Smith: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Sutton?

Councilmember Sutton: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Bassemier?

Councilmember Bassemier: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Hoy?

Councilmember Hoy: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Raben?

Councilmember Raben: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Lloyd?

Councilmember Lloyd: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: President Wortman?

President Wortman: No.

SCOTT TWP. ASSESSOR REQUESTED APPROVED
 

(Motion carried 6-1/Councilmember Wortman opposed)

H) UNION TOWNSHIP ASSESSOR

President Wortman: Union Township Assessor.

Councilmember Hoy: Mr. President, I make a motion that we approve this budget with the change in Training from $1,000 to $500 and that is my motion.

Councilmember Raben: I'll second that motion.

President Wortman: Got a motion and a second on the floor. Any discussion on that? Call the roll please.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Smith?

Councilmember Smith: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Sutton?

Councilmember Sutton: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Bassemier?

Councilmember Bassemier: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Hoy?

Councilmember Hoy: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Raben?

Councilmember Raben: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: Councilmember Lloyd?

Councilmember Lloyd: Yes.

Teri Lukeman: President Wortman?

President Wortman: No.

UNION TWP. ASSESSOR REQUESTED APPROVED
 

(Motion carried 6-1/Councilmember Wortman opposed)

President Wortman: Okay, that completes the Reassessment budget to be sent to the state for five months to the end of the year, so I'll entertain a motion for adjournment.

Councilmember Sutton: So moved.

Councilmember Raben: Second.

President Wortman: All those in favor say aye.

(Meeting adjourned at 3:40 p.m.)
 

_____________________________      ____________________________
President Curt Wortman                       Vice President Russell Lloyd, Jr.
 

____________________________       ____________________________
Councilmember James Raben               Councilmember Phil Hoy
 

____________________________       ____________________________
Councilmember Ed Bassemier              Councilmember Royce Sutton
 

____________________________
Councilmember Betty Knight-Smith
 
 
 

Recorded by Teri Lukeman. Transcribed by Teri Lukeman, Charlene Timmons and B.J. Farrell