JOINT COUNTY COMMISSIONERS-CITY COUNCIL
SMOKING ORDINANCE PUBLIC HEARING
May 23, 2006
The Vanderburgh County Board of Commissioners and Evansville City Council met in joint session this 23rd day of May, 2006 at 6:05 p.m. at the Vanderburgh County 4-H Center Auditorium, 201 East Boonville-New Harmony Road for the purpose of hearing public comment on a proposed ordinance establishing non-smoking areas in Vanderburgh County and the City of Evansville.
Call to Order |
Commissioner Shetler: We will begin the process, first of all, I really want to compliment, and there’s a lot of the same faces that were here the other night, but there are a few new faces. I want to complement everyone for how well they behaved. We did have one incident, and I think some of that may have erupted because we perhaps allowed a little bit too much support for one side or another and maybe it would be best to try to keep that down this time so that we don’t end up with any kind of interruptions like that. But I do think that everyone was very polite and very courteous and very professional in the way they conducted themselves, and I greatly appreciated that, and I know that we’re going to continue to do that same thing this evening. Tonight I might conduct things a little differently, in that, as you signed in, we will be calling people up in order. There’s been three of four people that have come up and asked me if they could come up a little sooner because of conflicts that they had, and we will be honoring that. But otherwise, we will pretty well stick to the schedule here. The first person that, well, first of all, let me introduce everyone and I guess I’m going to have to pretty well do this, at the far end is Mr. Joe Gries, who is the Deputy Auditor in the Auditor’s Office; to his right is Mr. Steve Bagbey, who is the second ward City Councilman; John Hamilton, who is the City Attorney; and Angela Koehler, who represents that fifth ward; and Cheryl Musgrave, who is my cohort and the President of our County Commission; Ted Ziemer, to my left, who is our County Attorney; to the very far right, you probably don’t get that very often, do you Keith? To the very far right is Keith Jarboe, who represents the City Council at-large; and then Steve Melcher, who is representing the third ward City Council. So again, I thank you for being here this evening. And we do have an attendance sheet that we’re going to be passing around, if you would please sign it so that we’ll have it for our record, whether you plan to speak or not. The speaker sheets were back there on the very back table, so you can still fill one out if you’re coming in. And if you wish to speak and you didn’t get, at the back table back there, make sure you do fill that out. The first speaker that we have is Mr. Robert Stayman. And it’s the same process – yeah, same process where we will be having three minutes. There’s an electronic deal up there and I think at the two minute mark, you’ll get a yellow caution light that will come on. When the red light comes on, your three minutes is up. So thank you.
Robert Stayman: Thank you very much, members of the Council and Commission, esteemed Counsel, I speak to you tonight as president of the Vanderburgh County Board of Health, my name is Bob Stayman and I am here to indicate the County Board of Health’s unanimous, unequivocal support for passage of both the city and the county ordinance. I want to bring to your attention a bit of business that was conducted by the Board of Health last month and I want to read to you from the preamble of that bit of business. Environmental tobacco smoke, we found, also referred to as second-hand smoke, is classified as a group A carcinogen under the Environmental Protection Agency’s carcinogen assessment guideline. And exposure to ETS, environmental tobacco smoke, causes lung cancer, nasal-sinus cancer, and has been linked to an increased risk for heart disease in non-smokers. Ladies and gentlemen, those are facts. That’s not somebody’s opinion, and that’s not idle speculation. Those are facts and for that reason, the County Board of Health adopted this resolution, that the Vanderburgh County Board of Health supports optimal protection of the public through an ordinance requiring smoke-free environments in all schools, workplaces, and public places. Lest you think the board can talk the talk but not walk the walk, I would also point out to you that your county Board of Health has been smoke-free since last year. And since this year, we have a 100% non-smoking administration and staff. We are proud of that, we think that shows how committed we are to this issue, we strongly support the passage of ordinances both in the city and the county. Thank you very much for your time.
Commissioner Shetler: Thank you. Bob, I have a question.
(Inaudible)
Robert Stayman: I’m sorry, I didn’t hear that.
Unidentified: Do you live in the city or county or outside?
Robert Stayman: I live in the county.
Commissioner Shetler: Any other questions? The next is Daniel Josey.
Daniel Josey: My name is Daniel Josey, and I work at Whirlpool, I live in Evansville and have all my life. The main reason that I came here to talk to you guys was about the effects that this proposal will have on my veteran’s club that I belong to. Now I am speaking for myself, I’m not speaking for the club, but I can tell you, I just wanted to share some observations that I had from being in the club and around the club. Our club basically pays its bills through proceeds that are derived from a bar that’s inside of our club and at any given time, if you sit at that bar, and look around the bar, actually about four times I’ve done it since this whole thing started, and that smallest percentage of smokers at the bar was about 60 percent. And one evening, the largest was 90%. Now we pay our bills and we do things for the community from the proceeds that we get from the bar. And if we lose 70% of these proceeds, we won’t be able to do a lot of activities that we do for our members as well as for veterans that live in the community and as well as just regular people in the community. We give Christmas and Thanksgiving baskets out, we pass out medicines at the VA Clinic. We support Soldiers & Sailors homes in Indiana, just to name a few things that our club does, not to mention the other clubs, the American Legion. Now when these 70% of these people are no longer in our club, buying our drinks, helping us pay our bills, we’re going to be in dire financial straits, and I don’t know what we’re going to do. I don’t know how we’re going to pay our bills. And for that reason, I plead that you exempt all veterans organizations from this proposal. There’s also a lot of effects that this is going to have on private business. And I don’t know if anybody has actually looked at the effect that this is going to have on private businesses, but if they’re anyway in the same situation that we are, there’s going to be people that are going to lose their businesses. When the ban passed in New York City, hundreds of bars closed. These bars paid taxes, their employees paid taxes, so I think that we really need to consider what we’re doing and work with the private bar owners and come to some kind of compromise so that we can continue to collect the tax revenue from their bars and they can continue to operate their businesses in the manner that they’ve been accustomed to. I’d like to thank you very much for your time.
Commissioner Shetler: Thank you. Any questions? Next is Barbara Hancock.
Barbara Hancock: I guess we don’t have a box for the short people. My name is Barbara Hancock, I’m from Evansville. I am a non-smoker. I would like to appeal to the advocates of the smoking ban, if the ordinance is passed as it is, smokers will not have any place to go out to eat. There are smoke-free restaurants for you. Freedom is a very delicate and precious thing, freedom to chose is one of the reasons this country is the great country that it is. If your choice denies others’ freedom, then it diminishes your freedom, too. You could be next on some things that you like to do. The neighborhood mom and pop operations, small businesses, just the regular friendly people and the small-town ways that makes Evansville a great place to be, are a lot of these small businesses, small neighborhood taverns, and small mom and pop restaurants. Please let us keep them. They’re what makes our small town a great town. And these businesses will be hurt and possibly eliminated. The ordinance, the way it stands, is unfair and denies people the right to chose. Let’s work on it together. Most places provide smoking and non-smoking areas already. Maybe this can be improved a little bit, but at least let the business owners chose for themselves, have the freedom to chose. The smoking ban advocates keep saying step outside. These advocates need to inform themselves of what this ordinance really says. Not within forty feet of a business. Nothing with a roof. Nothing with two walls. Uh-Uh. You’re taking other peoples’ rights away. This can be solved with a sign on the door or a wall or a door between the different sections to separate the smokers from the non-smokers. Let’s don’t turn our law abiding smoking citizens into law breakers over something we can reasonably work out together. Our city and counties have tight budgets, lets not open up ourselves to a lot of lawsuits from business owners, smokers and whatever, because their rights have been denied. Let’s be fair. If you own a business, if you owned a business, you would want to chose. A lot of them don’t want to chose between their smokers and their non-smokers and they shouldn’t have to. And if I may say something to Ms. Koehler-Walden, I heard your opinion the other night, and you have every right to your opinion, but I was kind of surprised. One of the reasons I am here defending something that I don’t even do, is because your dad was my government teacher. He instilled in me a belief in freedom of choice, individual rights and justice for all people, not just some. I thank you for your time.
Commissioner Shetler: Mr. Bill Nix has joined us I didn’t mention him, County Commissioner as well. So the next name is Mr. Harold Beecher, Mt. Vernon Road.
Harold Beecher: City Council, Vanderburgh County, I’m here because I’m alive because I quit smoking about twelve years ago with open heart surgery. You cannot see any stains between my fingers from smoking because I quit smoking. The idea is that I can breathe because I quit smoking. You can go to St. Mary’s, Deaconess, and Welborn and see all the patients in there with asthma, or other lung related diseases that they cannot breathe. And we are in a very limited area as far as the smoke we breathe and the air, and then you get into a building where there’s smokers, you’re not going to live too long. And I’m 74 years old, and I’m not afraid to die because I have been there before. I will not stand for people that blow smoke in my face, and I’ll never stand for it, over my dead body. Thank you.
Commissioner Shetler: The next speak is Mr. Vince Hill and then I’d like to have Terry Andry next, if they could be waiting off to the side so that we might be able to get it moving a little quicker. So Vince Hill and then Terry Andry will be the next up.
Vince Hill: Hi, my name is Vince Hill and I am a thinking, non-smoking adult, American citizen, who strongly believes in personal freedom of choice and the rights of individuals not to be subjected to invasive governance. It is not the role of the government to pass legislation that infringes on the rights of individuals to make choices about how they conduct their everyday lives. Even if they chose to engage in unhealthy activities such as smoking or overeating. The mandatory seatbelt law is a perfect example of such legislation. Whether or not we wear a seatbelt should be the choice of the person sitting behind the wheel or any other adult in the car. However, as well as we all know, that is a bell that can’t be unrung. Hundreds of thousands of people are harmed or killed by medical mistakes by hospitals and doctors every year. Do we now pass a ordinance that you can no longer go to the doctor of the hospital? While I agree the public venues that everyone go to for whatever reason should be smoke-free, I wonder why anyone would want to penalize businesses, private clubs, and make them lose money in privately held and run establishments. Why is it so difficult to let people make their own choice about whether or not they frequent a place of business that allows smoking? Who do some people feel the need to force their opinions and preferences on others? It is not the role of the government to be our nanny. We, as adults, should be free to chose where we spend our money and property owners and private clubs should be able to chose how they run their businesses. Surely reasonable people can come to some kind of compromise on this that is agreeable to all and not so punitive. Thank you.
Commissioner Shetler: Okay, the next speaker is Terry Andry and then after that, is Larry Pile.
Terry Andry: I’d like to thank the County Commission and the City Council for bringing us this opportunity, and freedom of debate is what democracy is about. And we have a lot of people that care about what is being done here. And we appreciate the opportunity to say so. I know growing up when someone said, “Do you mind if I smoke?” It was almost automatic: you had to say, “Why no.”, because everybody smoked. But then, you know, when we found out in ‘65 that cigarettes causes lung cancer, well, you know, they laughed at the guy, kind of. That’s government intruding. I don’t know how many people had to die before people started finally changing their mind about it. I know, I had a great aunt that was dying of cancer and told my niece to get her a cigarette and my niece said, no way. But we’ve all seen the problems, we’ve all seen, I’ve worked in a hotel and I’ve had to scrub brown sticky caffeine off the walls. They didn’t inhale and the walls didn’t smoke, and it would stick, the same way off an old car window, and it would stick, grimy. What does that do to people’s lungs? Now people say that, one side of the debate is we’ve got a right to smoke, freedom of choice. And that sounds kind of good except as the little girl said in Turoni’s about eight or nine years ago, she thought she had a right to breathe. She had asthma. People, when you exhale smoke, you’re affecting the lives and the people around you. Okay? The old guy said,”You’re right to swing your elbows ends where my nose begins.” We have to consider the other people because when we exhale the smoke, we’re affecting the other people. The doctor the other night said that, you know, if you want to take a hit of nicotine, you have a right to do so, and he didn’t care. But when you exhale smoke and someone else has to breathe it, you’re affecting their rights. Again, I would applaud the city and the Council for looking into the issue and for tackling the issues. A lot of states have tackled the issues and have stopped it because its affecting lives, its draining our Medicare and Medicaid programs of millions of dollars and its time that if you can, to put a stop to it. Thank you.
Larry Pile: I’m Larry Pile, I’m director of Human Resources for Deaconess Hospital. First of all, I want to thank you all for giving us this opportunity. Is this better now? I beg your pardon?
Unidentified: Do you live in the city or county or outside?
Larry Pile: I live in Warrick County, I work in Vanderburgh County, but I’m representing Deaconess Hospital. We have over 4,000 employees. On November 19th, Deaconess Hospital, along with many other businesses in the tri-state area joined the fresh air partners and we went smoke-free at Deaconess Hospital. We think it was the right thing to do at the right time to support our employees and the patients that come there and their visitors. Its been successful for us and we felt like it was step that we needed to take. We’ve taken other steps to be aggressive with our employees and to try to get them to adopt healthy lifestyles. We think supporting this ordinance would be another step in supporting healthy lifestyles. If you want to control costs, you’ve got to take aggressive and assertive steps and support healthy habits and healthy lifestyles. We think this ordinance would do that and I have noticed tonight that there’s some slogans saying, our health, our business. At Deaconess, we would change that. We would say its your health, its our business. And we want to do that right thing with that. Thank you.
Commissioner Shetler: Next is Mary Beth Nalin and then Karly and Kelly Bowman.
Mary Beth Nalin: Hello, my name is Mary Beth Nalin, I’m a resident of the city. First of all, thank you for my three minutes of time this evening. I want to say for the record that I’m a non-smoker with a history of respiratory problems all my life. And I am unequivocally opposed to the ban on smoking. I have nice little note cards with a speech that explains why, but I’m going to put them aside, because as I’m listening to speeches, things are occurring to me. And all that keeps going through my head is a quote that I heard once, I can’t remember the exact thing, and its driving me crazy, but its something to the effect that the United States had survived a civil war, the division between north and south, the division between east and west, but the writer wasn’t sure that we could survive the division between smoking and non-smoking sections. And as this keeps coming up again and again, those are the two sides that keep coming out, its smokers versus non-smokers. And it shouldn’t be because neither one of them have any sort of right to either smoke in a private establishment, which restaurants are, nor do they have a right to breathe clean air in a private establishment. The main problem we seem to have is the difference between public and private places. A restaurant, whatever you might think, is not established for the benefit of its patrons. It is established for the benefit of the business owners. Business owners are the ones who have the rights in this arrangement. Sure, they depend on the good will of their customers, they depend on them for their success, but they don’t have to take into account what they want when they set their policies. If it comes out that they would have more business if they outlawed smoking, then that’s what they’ll do, its called a free market. Its worked remarkably well for a pretty long time. I personally would rather be in a non-smoking restaurants because I don’t like to breathe smoke, it makes me sneeze, I can’t breathe very well, but I also really like the feeling of living in a country where I know that if I’m in a non-smoking restaurant, its because the owner has decided that that’s what they wanted for their business. You do not have to eat, drink or socialize in a smoking environment. You make a choice to do so. On the day that somebody puts a gun to your head and escorts you into a smoking environment and forces you to inhale, at that point you will have experienced a legitimate violation of your rights. In this city, it is entirely possible to never enter a smoking establishment, because all of the buildings where you are required to go, such as schools, hospitals, government buildings, already do not have smoking. Anywhere else you chose to go, whether it be a restaurant, a bar, a casino, whatever, you made a conscious decision to go there and you could chose not go there, just call ahead and ask if they have smoking. If they do, tell them you’re not going to come because you don’t like it. If they get enough of those phone calls, I’m sure they will stop allowing smoking there. So thank you for your time and good luck making, what I’m sure, is a difficult decision.
Commissioner Shetler: Karly and Kelly Bowman are coming up next, and then after that, Pete Gallion.
Kelly Bowman: Hi, my name is Kelly Bowman, I live in Vanderburgh County. This is my daughter, Karly. I’m a single mother –
Commissioner Shetler: Speak into the microphone.
Kelly Bowman: I’m a single mother of two children and I’m very family oriented. Ninety-five percent of the places where I go, my children go with me. And we chose to go into private clubs such as the American Legion and Riverbend. These are family oriented places, my children enjoy going to them and so do I. This is something we’d like to continue doing. And as a private club member, we pay to be in these organizations and we should decide as a club and organization whether we want to be smoking or not. And I don’t think, you know, anybody is totally against this ordinance. I think everybody is willing to compromise, as a city we should join together and compromise on this. I think that the small privately owned business that would like to keep theirs smoking, and they have family dining, which is already non-smoking. And the private clubs, you know, would like to continue to have it be a family environment and allow the patrons that want to smoke to be able to smoke. And as a citizen, its my choice whether I want to go into these private clubs knowing that there is smoking there and its my choice as a parent, if I shall bring my children in there. This is something we enjoy doing together as a family and its something we’d like to continue enjoy doing. And I just feel like there’s, you know, some kind of compromise where we can work together and do this ordinance where everybody can come to an agreement. And my daughter Karly would like to speak.
Karly Bowman: I like going to the American Legion and Riverbend with my mom and grandparents. I want to be able to continue going to these places.
Kelly Bowman: Thank you.
Commissioner Shetler: Thank you. Pete Gallion and Douglas Fox. Douglas Fox will be next.
Pete Gallion: My name is Pete Gallion and I’m a non-smoker. I’m alive because God let me be alive. I am an American citizen. We were founded on by the people, for the people, not a few peckerwoods that’s going to rule for everybody in the whole city. Its not right. My brother died of cancer, he was not a smoker, but he also told me, there’s a lot of stuff in Whirlpool you don’t realize goes on. His son, who is a minister has never smoked, has cancer. Ask all these kids down at St. Jude’s if they smoked. No, they don’t. This is wrong. You people know its wrong. I heard somebody on the Council last week say, smokers don’t have rights. Crap! The man from Deaconess Hospital, if it wasn’t for smokers and sick people, he wouldn’t have a job, he’d be down at the septic sewer doing something. You people sit up here like you’re above the law. Why has the Sheriff’s Department got a room for their deputies to smoke in? Why does the courthouse allow smoking between the judge’s chambers and the courtroom? It’s a double-edged sword. You don’t allow prisoners to smoke, but you allow your deputies to smoke. You don’t allow smoking in the courthouse, but you allow your lawyers and your judges to smoke. I had my ear cut off, I’ve had my nose broke, I’ve a blackjack mark, I’ve got a cut up here, but not by a smoker, but by a drunk. Where are we going to draw the line here? Come on people, let’s be Americans. Let’s put it to a vote, not just a few of you. You probably got your mind made up and this is probably a farce. And you’re probably whizzing on these people’s head and telling them its raining and a lot of them is believing it, but you’ve done got your mind’s made up and its wrong. That’s all I have to say. Thank you.
Commissioner Shetler: Douglas Fox, and then after that will be Johnny Kincaid. Douglas Fox?
Douglas Fox: This is a tough room to work. Good evening, members of the county, members of the City and County Councils. My name is Doug Fox, and I do live in Union Township. I’m commander of AmVets Post 84, I’m here this afternoon not as an elected representative for the Council of Veteran’s Organization of Vanderburgh County, which includes over 14 veterans organizations with memberships of over 16,000 people in Vanderburgh County. I am not here as an advocate for pro or anti-smoking, but as an advocate of freedom of choice. The one thing all these organizations have in common is, from to time, we all have young people under the age of 18 in our posts and clubs. Our posts and clubs are governed by our own constitution and bylaws on a national and state level that allow and encourage our members’ children and grandchildren to take part in post and club activities especially designed for youth groups. We adhere to all federal, state, county, city laws pertaining to day-to-day operation. We are non-profit, so after paying the bills, most of our money goes back into community programs for the betterment of the city and county. Our post and club rooms are equipped with smoke eaters and ventilation systems for the comfort of all, our members young and old alike. We hope with a better quality of air than the city and county parks and playgrounds. Our young people are not in our posts from opening to closing every day and in most places, there is a set time when minors must be out of the post. Children have always been a part of veterans organizations. The American Legion has sponsored youth baseball for decades, VFW Post 1114 sponsors a local boy scout troop, and AmVets Junior AmVets has an annual essay program about Americanism worth thousands of dollars in scholarships nationwide, just to name a few. Veterans clubs are family oriented, however, I can’t pronounce that word, and try to include the family members in the different club activities throughout the year, such as family picnics, Easter egg hunts and Christmas parties. We are very proud of our veteran heritage and try to instill on our young people the sacrifices our veterans have made over the years so they might realize that freedom is not free. When we were young soldiers, sailors and marines from World War II to Viet Nam and even Desert Storm, smoking was very much en vogue, cigarettes were even included in C rations then. Our veterans feel it is their right to smoke in their clubs if they so chose. The anti-smoking ordinance as it is written, as stated in Article 9.80.03 Paragraph A Section 8E allows no one under 18 years of age in our posts or clubs at any time if there is smoking, and no smoking if anyone under 18 years of age is allowed anywhere in the facility or the building at any time. What the Council of Veterans Organization of Vanderburgh County would like to propose is to omit Section E from said ordinance. We feel with the omission of Section E that it is an ordinance we can all live it. We also feel if this ordinance is passed as it is now written, it will cause adverse repercussions that will be felt all the way to the State House. We thank you for this audience, your time, and your consideration.
(Tape Change)
Johnny Kincaid: Thank you very much for making the sacrifice of time to be here this evening. I’m sure, that like me, some of you would rather be home watching American Idol tonight. It’s the final. I’m cheering for Taylor. By the way, did you know that Taylor is a big supporter of the smoke free ordinance? Well, okay, I made that up, alright? I made it up so that I could prove a point to you about making unsubstantiated claims. Sometimes those unsubstantiated claims sound pretty good on the surface. Like a local bar owner who on television one night said that this ordinance is going to ruin the bar business here as it has in Chicago. Now the problem is that the tv station didn’t fact check. The ordinance in Chicago doesn’t affect bars until the year 2008. I’m asking you to fact check as well. That is why we put together a little fact sheet so that when somebody says the sky is falling, you don’t have to believe the sky is falling. You can just check the facts. When somebody says this ordinance will hurt my business you can check the sheet here that says this ordinance will hurt my business and here are the economic impact studies done in communities like ours all across the county that prove that smoke free ordinances do not cause economic harm. Now the question that we wind up with here is who are you going to listen to? Who are you going to pay attention to? Last week I talked about 70 percent of your constituents want this ordinance and expect it to be passed with no exemptions. Are you going to listen to them? Or are you going to listen to those that you get to gather with for breakfast on a weekly basis? Are you going to listen to the medical community? Are you going to listen to your friends and family who don’t want to be inconvenienced by this ordinance? Are you going to listen to political leaders? We’ve got a republican governor who says he wants this for economic development and we’ve got a democrat as a mayor who says he wants this for economic development and we’ve got four democrats on the City Council that are turning their back on the mayor’s economic vision for this community. Some of those people are not here tonight unfortunately to listen to input from the community. Are you going to listen to the conspiracy theorist who are going to talk to you about the fact that secondhand smoke isn’t harmful at all? You know, if you listen to those people, what it means is, that everybody from the surgeon generals for the last 30 years to the CDC, the EPA, the Indiana State Department of Health, Vanderburgh County Department of Health, the Vanderburgh County Medical Society, with their 500 physician members, that they’re all somehow involved in a conspiracy to lie to us and take away our freedoms, when the simple fact is we know what happens with secondhand smoke. If you weigh the evidence, if you look at your email in boxes and see how many positive comments you have received on this, 80 to three in some cases, if you look at the public input 70 percent support this ordinance. If you weigh the evidence as far as health goes there is only one conclusion you can come to and that is to pass this ordinance by a vote of nine to zero in the city and to pass it by a vote of three to nothing in the county. I thank you for your time and your consideration.
Commissioner Shetler: Johnny, we’ve got a question here.
Unidentified: Do you live in the city or the county?
Johnny Kincaid: I live in the city...or live in the county and work in the city. The person that you’re going to hear from on tape is a lady who is at her grandchild’s graduation tonight and that is why she couldn’t be here and she really wanted to be able to testify and share her story with you, so we’re going to give you an opportunity to get her story on tape and we have to kind of, you know, make do with things here a little bit.
Unidentified video: Most people just think that you can’t be allergic to smoke, that it doesn’t bother anybody but themselves. But it does bother people because when I go into a restaurant if there is smoke there I have to leave, I can’t sit in there and enjoy a meal. I have went over to Henderson, Kentucky to a grocery store, I had lived there at the time, and I just went in to buy a few groceries. I did not realize that they allowed you to smoke in there because I have seen people with oxygen tanks and things and didn’t think about it, and I started smelling smoke. I ended up having an asthma attack and ended up in ICU at the Henderson hospital. It’s nice to see that the malls don’t have smoking in there now too, because I can actually go pick out my own clothes. For a long while people would just buy things and then bring them to me because I couldn’t get out and do things. You have to clean the stoma every morning and you have to change the pads and make sure that there is no infection or anything going in there. You also have to wear the necklaces around there to hold the trache in. If I took the top off from it I wouldn’t be able to talk. You have to take the middle part out and clean it every day and then put it back in. I can’t go swimming and diving the way that I used to. I can’t do a lot of things that I used to do. I have to wait and find out is there somebody smoking over there. I can’t come down here when we have functions down at the river. I can’t go into different parties and things. No, I would never have gone in the grocery store if I knew that I was going to have this serious of a reaction and especially end up with a trache. I don’t want a trache.
Commissioner Shetler: Thank you. The next speaker is Robert Stevens and then the one after that is Catherine Engel. Robert Stevens and then Catherine Engel.
Robert Stevens: I’m Robert E. Stevens. I’m a non-smoker. I quit about 20 years ago, but I haven’t gained any weight. Just a joke I read a while ago. No, anti regardless of what it is, anti drinking, anti smoking, anti driving, they never really succeed.
Commissioner Shetler: If you could speak in that silver mic, the gray mike.
Robert Stevens: What’s the problem? Oh, you can’t hear what I said, uh? Maybe it’s just as well. No live and let live as far as I am concerned. Now, if you don’t like the restaurants that have smoking stay out of it. If you haven’t got guts enough to do that then you’re a lost cause anyway.
Commissioner Shetler: Thank you. Catherine Engel and then after that is Mike Young.
Catherine Engel: County Commissioners and City Council members. My name is Catherine McGraw Engel and I am a resident of Evansville. My husband died of lung cancer. Although his lung cancer was likely not smoke related, 87 percent of the lung cancers diagnosed are and thus are preventable. Have you ever watched someone die from lung cancer? I will spare you the details of this ravaging disease, but I will tell you it is heart breaking. Secondhand smoke not only takes lives by causing cancer, but also causing heart disease and stroke. For every eight people who died because of their choice to smoke they kill one non-smoker with their secondhand smoke. You cannot ignore the havoc that secondhand smoke causes and you must not neglect your responsibility to protect the public. A patron pays a restaurant to eat the food, not to smoke. A patron pays the bowling alley to bowl, not to smoke. A private business should have the right the regulate its own policy on how it runs its business activity, but it should not be allowed to condone behaviors that cause physical harm. That is exactly what secondhand smoke does. When a smoker lights that cigarette that emits carcinogens and respiratory irritants then that person is physically assaulting everyone who breathes that air. If you smell smoke those particles have physically reached your nose and have entered your respiratory system. Your nose may run or you may start to wheeze, but more often it doesn’t bother you and you’re not aware of the danger. You do not see the black deposits that accumulate in your lungs. You do not smell the odorless, poisonous carbon monoxide that you inhale which displaces the oxygen making you more susceptible to a heart attack or stroke. You do not see the changes in your respiratory lining caused by exposure to secondhand smoke day after day from working in a smoke filled environment. You do not know you are at risk because those bruises are not as obvious as the bruises when someone hits you. The risks are there and the effects can be tragic. Often lung cancer is not diagnosed until it is too late to treat except with palliative care. It is an invisible disease. Secondhand smoke kills. Please do not play a political game with people’s lives. Preventive measures must be taken and each of you has the authority and the responsibility to do just that. Please vote for this ordinance and thank you for letting me speak with you.
Commissioner Shetler: Mike Young and then Jack Eagan. Jack Eagan will be next.
Mike Young: Good evening. You know it seems people are always making rush decisions and not thinking how it will affect everyone around them. I would like to give a brief history on that subject. Back in the early 1800's our ancestors said you’re Native American, you don’t count. In the mid 1800's our ancestors said, you’re a slave, you don’t count. In the early 1900's people said, well, you’re a woman, you don’t count. In the 40's and 50's people said, well, you’re African American, you don’t count. You want to know something? We all count because the Native Americans, they counted, they got reservations. The slavery was abolished. Women, they can now vote. The African American can now go and sit anywhere he wants. Hopefully, the small business owners and smokers will find out that they count. I wish you would spend a week in a restaurant/bar owners’ position working 60 to 70 hours a week cooking, cleaning, repairing things, paperwork, hostess, waiter, chief bottle washer. At the end of the week when you’ve paid all the bills and you think, hey, I’ve made a profit and then somebody says your fryer, your cooler, or your air conditioning stopped working. Hey, there went the profits. You have to understand that every customer counts. The non-smokers as well as the smokers. Ever since the smoking ordinance was brought up I’ve seen smokers, non-smokers, friends and co-workers argue about the ordinance. I don’t believe that the City Council and the County Commissioners wanted a division of the community when they started discussing this issue. If what you really want is a community that works together, I propose as business owners and community leaders that we look at this where it benefits everyone. I’m not going to stand here and say how this will affect our business because you don’t know and I can’t guess how much, but we don’t have any guarantees. We all know smoking and secondhand smoke is bad for our health, but you also need to realize that restaurants are not the major contributors to secondhand smoke. Growing up, I can remember my parents protecting me from the boogeyman or the bad man. The restaurants aren’t the boogeyman, and they are not the bad man. It’s the drug dealers, the sexual predators and the peer pressure that our young people deal with every day. Let’s concentrate on protecting our kids from them. Our kids only know what we have told them over the years and I hope they make the right choices. In closing, what I propose is that the committee, that restaurant and bar owners form, would meet with Council and Commissioners privately and discuss the issues that would benefit all parties. All I am asking you is not to shut us out. I believe we can work together. Thank you.
Commissioner Shetler: Thank you, Mike. The next is Jack Eagan and then James Taylor. Jack Eagan and then James Taylor.
Jack Eagan: My name is Jack Eagan. I’m the president of the Tri-County Council of Clubs and I am also a line officer down at the No-Ruz Grotto. These are all private clubs that the general public cannot walk in to. The people that join those clubs, we don’t go out and drag them in and force them to join. They know whether they are smoking clubs or they are not smoking clubs and they still elect to join. A lot of the functions that all these clubs do helps benefit kids, underprivileged kids, and things like that. I don’t think it’s right that the Council tries to tell a private club that a normal off the street person can’t walk in the door and get in there that we can’t do what we want to do. I think that clubs need to be exempted and I think that’s your duty to do that. Thank you.
Commissioner Shetler: Thank you. James Taylor and then after that I’ve got Serita Cabell.
James Taylor: All I have to say is all the restaurants seem to have things pretty well under control. I mean, we all know when we go they ask you “smoking or non-smoking”. You know, it’s not like an issue. Most of them have gone to non-smoking except for the bars. I fail to see where the smoke out of a bar is going to interrupt anybody’s atmosphere in the other room. I mean, we’re talking part a million, you know. I mean, part a million. If we’re really concerned about people’s respiratory problems let’s look at G. E., let’s look at Vectren, let’s look at A. K. Steel. What about our ozone alerts during the summer, which is coming up. I mean, let’s get real about the situation. You know, I’m 39 today. I’m here on my birthday. My whole family is sitting there at the house and I’m up here talking with you fine people, you know. There is a thing called freedom. You know, we do have choices. How many of you all have friends that smoke? Or friends of friends? You know, we’ve all grown up with it. I’ve sat here and I’ve looked around the room. How many elderly people are in this room and how did we make it? How old were your grandparents when they died? How significant is really secondhand smoke affecting people unless you want to sit right next to somebody while they’re smoking? I mean, we have to be realistic about it. That’s the main thing is being realistic. I don’t think that shutting the bars down and saying, hey, we’re going to be smoke free everywhere because we have that covered, don’t we? I mean, it’s pretty well evident, you know. I mean, what am I going to say to you all? I’m just up here speaking about people’s freedoms, people’s choices. I don’t have any cards in front of me. But I rely on your intelligence and your background and your knowledge and your wisdom through your years that you all will make the right choice. I don’t think that people should be punished in this country and every single day that you start taking away people’s freedoms where is it going to stop because we all sit here and we all know...look at the gas prices. Look how everything is going. I mean, when is it going to stop? That’s the main thing. How far are we actually going to go with this. I guess that’s pretty much all I really have to say, you know. It’s up to you all and I hope that you really don’t punish people because when you get down to it you do have a choice and the restaurants have it covered. They really do. Thank you.
Commissioner Shetler: Thank you. Ms. Cabell, and then after that is Randy Muston.
Unidentified: Could you tell us again if you live in the city?
Serita Cabell: I live in the city and my name is Serita Cabell. I was first going to get up here and talk about my position in favor of the ordinance and my professional level I’m a certified prevention professional and I teach kids every day and I have to deal with them on teaching them about the impact of drugs, and alcohol, and violence and I think that we can make more of an impact by making smoking abnormal rather than keeping it and letting it be the norm. But on the second half I have a personal story as being a single parent and a mother. People have gotten up here and talked about their rights and their freedoms, but with rights and freedoms there comes responsibility and I have had to show responsibility by taking care of my son and working and I feel that I should be able to work in a place that allows me to be as healthy as possible to be able to take care of my child and to be able to take care of myself and my family. Until recently I did not even have a job where I made enough money to pay insurance...I didn’t have enough money to pay for insurance, but I made enough that I was not able to receive any assistance to help pay for that so my thoughts of things when I went out with my son were, well, we have to be careful in certain areas, we can only go here and there because we can’t afford to get sick. Having an ordinance like this can only help those people that are stuck in the middle class or stuck in positions that do not have insurance, but they are forced to work and they have to work and they know as a citizen that it is their responsibility to work. It’s up to us to pass this ordinance so that we are able to work in healthy conditions.
Commissioner Shetler: Thank you. Randy. After Randy is a Vera Blackman. Vera Blackman.
Randy Muston: Ladies and gentlemen of City Council and County Commission. I’m up here...I’ve heard and sat through the last meeting down at the courthouse and I’ve heard a lot of different things. You know, I’m a veteran, I’m a smoker. I think that the veterans’ organizations need to be and other private clubs, that people pay their own money to join and make that choice, should be exempt. Also, I am against this smoking policy for another reason also. Primarily is the individual’s rights. If everybody was so sure that this is what the community wants let’s put it to a vote on the ballot. Let’s quit trying to play dictatorship by nine people making a decision for everybody in this community. Let’s put it to a vote. Thank you.
Commissioner Shetler: Thank you. Vera Blackman and the a Mr. Ted Clark. Ted Clark after Vera.
Vera Blackman: Good afternoon. My name is Vera Blackman and I am representing Teresa Carter who is a business owner. She is the business owner of Going Forward Beauty & Barber Shop. She is not here tonight because she had to go to a graduation with her son. This is what she said, she said:
“I’m a black woman who feels strongly against me or anyone else having to inhale someone else’s cigarette smoke. What people do in their own homes is fine, but when it comes to my shop, my car, my kids, my family, no smoking is the only way. I don’t smoke and I don’t allow employees or customers to smoke in my establishment. As a business, having a no smoking policy is not a factor into my business sales and I don’t believe it will affect other businesses in a negative way. I am strongly in support of the city and county civil passing an ordinance to ban smoking in public areas and work places. I feel that if you can’t smoke in many places, then you hopefully be able to quit and not even smoke at home and subject anyone else to cigarette smoke. As a minority, I do agree with the majority. Most people do want to go to places and not have to be around cigarettes. I can say it in a polite way. I don’t think people should smoke in public places.”
This is from Teresa Carter. Now I want to speak on behalf of myself. I believe that I stand for the elderly, the young, and also those people who cannot speak for themselves. This is not necessarily an issue about smoking. This is an issue about esteeming other people better than ourselves. Right now we have to show other people love. We have to show love, more love for our children and also we must begin to have respect for our own bodies. Our body is the temple of the Lord. I speak from experience. I know it feels when I dress up, I put on deodorant, I go to a public place and I stink because of the smoke smell. So I just, you know, I wanted to just say I am in support of what you all do tonight. I want to say something about freedom, freedom, freedom. Oh, how I love freedom, but that does not give us the freedom to kill someone else along with ourselves. Thank you very much.
Commissioner Shetler: Mr. Ted Clark and then after that is Sherry Hurt.
Ted Clark: Good evening. My name is Ted Clark and I own Briar & Bean Tobacco Shop. I’ll get right to the point. I urge you to continue the exclusion for the retail tobacco shops from this ordinance. My shop only sells premium tobacco, cigars and related accessories. We don’t even sell the best produced cigarettes. Our only customers are those who enjoy premium tobacco products, a product of leisure and pleasure, not one of addiction. Premium tobacco, unlike mass produced cigarettes, could almost be considered an organic product, no chemical additives with the exception of fertilizers in the beginning of the growing season. Premium tobacco shops provide a very small segment of the community as a special place, a quite location where responsible adults only, of different backgrounds, financial means, race and religion can congregate and share a common pleasure, a premium cigar or a pipe. When we moved to our current location at the corner of Vogel and Burkhardt, the smoke shop was constructed with the thought of the ordinance similar to this coming up. The smoke shop has a completely separate ventilation system with a state of the art smoke removers. To ban smoking in a premium tobacco shop, would be like telling a restaurant they can sell all the food they want just as long as none of the customers eat their food in their restaurant. It would make no sense. The following states and cities that exempted premium retail tobacco shops from their smoking ordinance include: Florida, New York, New Jersey, Massachusetts, California, even, yes, California excluded smoke shops, a lot of states. Some cities that excluded smoke shops: Louisville, Lexington, New York City, Cincinnati, even Bloomington and Indianapolis. In closing, we do not cater to children. We neither sell to or admit people under the age of 18. We do not cater to non smokers. They have no reason to be there. We are a destination location that caters only to those 18 and above who want to purchase and utilize premium tobacco products. Therefore, retail tobacco shops should be excluded from a non smoking ordinance. Vanderburgh County’s proposed ordinance in its current form excludes retail tobacco shops and I urge you to continue this exclusion. Thank you very much.
Commissioner Shetler: Ted, let me ask you a couple of questions. Do you serve food or drink in that establishment?
Ted Clark: I had written here that I am not a restaurant or a tavern owner, but I thought I would run out of time so I shortened it. No, I do not.
Commissioner Shetler: Okay. Alright, thank you.
Ted Clark: You’re welcome.
Councilman Melcher: Where do you live?
Ted Clark: I live in Henderson, Kentucky, but I own Briar & Bean and have paid property taxes here for 25 years.
Commissioner Shetler: Sherry Hurt and then Lisa Murt.
Sherry Hurt: I am a citizen of Vanderburgh County, a mother and a public health nurse. I support the smoke free ordinance because secondhand smoke is a very serious health issue. However, many seem to think it’s a rights issue, so I would like to address that topic as well. Many citizens have expressed it is their right to choose to smoke where they want. It is a free country. The rights that are afforded our free country as stated in the Preamble to the Constitution are for the common good, not just for the elite, not just big business, not for a subgroup of the population, but for we the people. Not only is America a free country, but we are also a civilized country. As such, all of our rights must be exercised responsibly for the good of the public welfare. Even the inalienable rights of the U. S. Constitution must be practiced responsibly. We have the right of free speech, but the responsibility not to slander, incite or become a nuisance to others. We have the right to bear arms, but not in a manner that inflicts harm on other citizens. As individuals we even have the right to choose risky behaviors for ourselves, but must do so responsibly. We have the right to drink alcohol, but not the right to drink and drive because that may harm others. We have the right to bungee jump, but not the right to drag someone down with us against their will. American citizens have the right to smoke, but not the right to force this risky behavior on others. The service men and women of America, for which I have the highest respect, have put their lives on the line to protect these freedoms and to protect our citizens from harm. However, I do not believe that even one of them risk their lives to protect a freedom for America that meant the right to do what you want even if it caused harm to another citizen. We must never confuse freedom with lawlessness. Nowhere in the United States Constitution, the Bill of Rights, the state or city legislation is any citizen in public or a private setting granted, much less guaranteed, the right to inflict harm on another citizen. Within our abilities with this ordinance we will fight to protect the American citizens from harm also inflicted by others to the tun of 53,000 deaths per year. Business owners have stated that they should have a right to choose if customers may smoke in their establishments. Again, these rights come with responsibility. The right to own a business allows owners to invite customers, clients, members and employees into their establishments. With that comes the responsibility to provide for these citizens’ welfare. It is not new for businesses to be regulated. Regulations for food, safety, fire exits and cleanliness are just some of the requirements to protect the public welfare. The simple separation of smokers from non smokers within the same air space cannot eliminate the risk of exposure to secondhand smoke. I have one more paragraph can I finish?
Commissioner Shetler: No, I’m sorry. Alright, thank you very much. Leah Murt. Leah Murt...or is that Leah Hurt, I’m sorry.
Leah Hurt: It’s Leah.
Commissioner Shetler: Yeah.
Leah Hurt: I’m actually finishing for a...I’m sorry. These were words given to me by my mother. I think they are very pertinent and as a member of the community and a citizen of Evansville for 20 years I would like to bring this to your attention. To the Council members, I was surprised to hear that some of our elected officials do not feel that this is the place for government. This is a very complex issue. Some citizens feel their right to smoke is threatened. Others feel their right to clean air is threatened. Businesses feel their freedom to choose is threatened, but most importantly it is a serious health issue. The definition of govern is to regulate. This should not be decided by popularity, ease or profitability. It is your duty, as elected representatives of Evansville citizens, to regulate that the right to smoke is exercised responsibly for the good of the public welfare. It is the right thing to do. Thank you so much for your time.
Tom Shetler: Thank you. Missy Singer.
(Tape Change)
Missy Singer: Thank you. Sorry. I have been working with Citizens for Smokefree Evansville for approximately two years on this issue to raise awareness about the ill effects of secondhand smoke and tobacco use. Tonight I’m going to share with you some of my personal experiences, as well as some of my professional experiences. I hope that our representatives that aren’t here will watch and listen to the newspaper, to listen to some of the comments of today’s representatives. Professionally, as a nurse practitioner, I have vowed to help promote the health and well being of others, for others to achieve maximum quality of life. This is what I’m doing here tonight. My job is to fight for all people who practice even the most unsafe health habits. And, yes, it is their choice, but many times choices become addictions. And, truthfully, smoking and nicotine is an addiction by the definition. Eighty percent of the people who have unsafe health habits and addictions wish they did not. Of smokers, only one percent will actually be quit a year later. When I speak with my patients, and when I ask them, “Well, what got you started again?”, many of them say, “I don’t know. I was just out with my friends and we lit up.” That is a common, common story over and over again. By allowing smoking in public places, we’re allowing people to continue their addiction that is hurting them. Social pressures and social environments allow addictions to continue, and research has proven that this harms them and other people. I’m doing my job here tonight. What I would like to ask you to do is to do your job. Seventy percent of Evansville citizens, by a poll, have expressed a want to, sorry, a want to pass a comprehensive ordinance. I expect 70 percent of our representatives to then vote that way. There are many laws that I’m not fond of, but I know that protect me and my family. From a personal standpoint, my father had open heart surgery this year, at the age of 52. We are west siders and frequent Hagedorn’s, Hilltop, St. Joe Tavern, St. Wendel Inn on a very random, on a very frequent basis. I remember the day that I went down to Hagedorn’s and we ate breakfast, and I left and I smelled, and my two year old son smelled, and my parents smelled, and my dad had his surgery, and, I said, “Dad, as a health care professional, I advise you not to enter any place that allows smoking. I do not want you to smoke anymore, as a health care advisor.” It was very difficult for me to tell my dad that he couldn’t go to Hagedorn’s and see Keith, and see Woody, and see all his friends. It also is very difficult for me to think that I won’t be able to go to the St. Joe Inn because of the smoking that is allowed there, because I won’t allow myself to do it anymore. I encourage my 30 something friends to not do it either. We are the people that are frequenting these establishments on a regular basis. We are the future of Evansville. We are the future who promote and are supportive of this ordinance, and I ask you to listen to the people who are going to be the future of this city.
Commissioner Shetler: Thank you. Elizabeth Volk, and then Rene Hicks. Do what? You’re not going to speak at all then? Okay, sure. Elizabeth Volk has, she’s going to yield to this gentleman.
Gary Cosby, Sr.: First of all ladies and gentleman, my name’s not Libby, my name’s Gary Cosby, Sr. I’m a Vietnam Vet and I can talk up, because I feel very strongly about what I’m speaking about tonight. First of all, this, I don’t get paid for speaking. There’s a gentleman here, quite a few people here that get paid for speaking. So, see, let’s take them people off the bank roll here. Second of all, the Bible says, “Thou shall not put any other god before Me”. There is not one person sitting up there that’s God. You should not make the decision for Vanderburgh County or for the City of Evansville. I served my country. I served my country proud. It would be amazing to see, I know one man served his country. How many others served our country? It’s not about country, it’s about the small business owner. It’s about the taverns. I owned a tavern. If it wasn’t for my smokers, I couldn’t have stayed in business. I couldn’t have paid my utility bills, my water bills or nothing. So, where are we coming from here? This is not over the VFW, this is not over American Legion. This is over our rights. We are free Americans. We should have that choice. You’re not giving us a choice. You’re not even listening to a choice. Nobody won’t even listen to a referendum. No, no, there’s two, four, six, eight, ten people think that they have all the buying for 170,000 individuals. Well, contrary to your popular belief, not being rude, you don’t. There is not a tavern, or a bar, or an organization around this town that says, “Beware of Smoking”, everybody knows that taverns smoke, organizations smoke. I just don’t understand this. You people are not even listening to us. You know, it’s like you already have your mind made up. You know, can you explain this to me and these other people. You know, seeing this little movie on here about this woman talking about, well, I couldn’t go in the grocery store. Well, name one grocery store that you can walk in and smoke. You know, name one. You can’t. You can’t do it in Schnuck’s, you can’t do it nowhere. So, see, all of that is political bull crap. You know, and I don’t get paid. Mr. Kincaid does though. I don’t work for the Cancer Society. Buzz me off, guys. I ought to get the ten minutes he got, but that’s alright. To sum this all up, it’s not about, it’s about the citizens, the taxpaying citizens of Vanderburgh County, it’s not about ten individuals. We pay the taxes. Why don’t we all stop paying taxes, and you guys pick up the taxes.
Commissioner Shetler: Alright, thank you. Rene Hicks, and after that it will be Dr. John Beman. After Rene is John Beman.
Rene Hicks: Thank you. Actually, I’m going to take this and talk at an angle, because I don’t want to just address the representatives and turn my back on the people, because that’s what it’s about. It’s about people. Because these are just your elected representatives. But, this is a government of the people, for the people, and by the people. I would like all the people here, who are concerned citizens, who have a complaint, who have a comment, and who is here expressing it, and taking part in the democratic process while other people just whine and sit their butts at home, please give yourselves a round of applause for being here and exercising the democratic process that makes this country great, whether we agree or disagree. Now, first of all I’m going to say that I’m a non-smoker. And, some of you may remember me, because I did some ads, because I have worked in Indiana as a comedian for many, many years. I was affected by secondhand smoke. In fact, I got lung cancer due to secondhand smoke, and I had a partial lung removal. Now, because I do not live here, I’m not here to tell you what to do, because my dad who was from the south, a Republican and a Pentecostal preacher says, “You don’t come to somebody else’s house and tell them how to clean it.” So, I am not here to do that. But, I am here to tell you that secondhand smoke is a health hazard. I’m here to say that. I’m here to say that bars and restaurants and casinos and comedy clubs are offices to those people who work there. I think that to say that there should be exemptions for those bars, restaurants, and casinos, and comedy clubs, is to make those workers, myself being one of them, second class citizens. In America I don’t think anybody here, for smoking or non-smoking, would consider that part of the American dream. I would like to say that people brought up a lot of things about freedom, and I love freedom, as the progeny of slaves, and somebody brought up slavery, let’s talk about that. Slavery was private individual’s right during the time. It was profitable for everyone. I have to say that. Our country wouldn’t be the country it is today, if not for slavery. Now, I can say that, I wouldn’t recommend you white people go out and tell people that, but I can say that. It was. But, it had to be abolished, because it was immoral. We have to look at things on all spectrums. My dad being a Pentecostal preacher, smoking is a health hazard. Some of my best friends are smokers, I don’t want smokers to smoke, I don’t want you to die. But, if you choose to do so, I support your personal choice, but please support mine. Don’t take me with ya’. Don’t take me with ya’. Don’t take me with ya’. Don’t take me with you. I love you, but don’t take me with you. They say you have to smoke, you have to smoke in bars. Nobody smokes in church. If you can stop smoking in church, why can you not smoke in bars as well. I would like to just say, and I will close, there’s going to come a time in America, with all injustices, when you will look back and say, “Why did we let this go on for so long?” Thank you very much.
Commissioner Shetler: Thank you, Rene. Dr. John Beman, and after that is Phyllis, is it Phyllis Swanson? Swanson is the last name.
John Beman: Mr. Chairman, members of the County and City Councils, my name is John Beman. I live in Scott Township. I come tonight to speak in favor of the smoke free environment in our workplaces and our enclosed public places in Vanderburgh County. As a physician that has done ear, nose and throat medicine for the last 30 years in Vanderburgh County. I have direct experience in finding the effects of secondary smoke on children and adults. Particularly those who work in the environments that are heavily contaminated with smoke, and also the homes. Most environments can’t clean the smoke well enough to protect them. Heating and air conditioning systems simply circulate the smoke, it does not clean it, it just circulates it. Open environments would be, obviously, more healthy. Environments with smoke eaters may be a benefit, but, again, it’s recircled air. So, enclosed environments are an endangerment to those sitting near it. I’ve been interested mostly in respiratory tract illnesses, but also it has been proven in tests that even temporary short term secondhand smoke raises the heart rate and the blood pressure in an equal amount as those who are directly exposed to the smoke. Long term effects to both of them, obviously, are a little bit less involved with the secondary smoke, but, nevertheless, it increases our insurance, our medical costs to our community. A smoke free environment might be an inducement for outside industry, reducing their insurance costs. Thank you.
Commissioner Shetler: Thank you, John. Ms. Swanson, Ms. Swanson, Patty Swanson, and then Lynda Harris after that.
Patricia Swanson: Thank you for having us here. Can you hear now? Thank you for letting us speak. I am a resident of Vanderburgh County, a registered voter who votes every election. I’m also an asthmatic. I take maintenance inhalers twice a day, every day, morning and night. I never go anywhere without my emergency inhaler. I have heard people say they are afraid that if you pass the smoke free environment, they are going to lose money in their business, they will lose customers. I’m here to tell you they already have lost customers. I don’t go to any bar in Evansville because of the smoke. It would set me off. Tobacco is one of my triggers. I would like to go hear some of the bands I read about. I would like to hear some of the jazz, and I can’t. There are restaurants that have no smoking areas, and you walk in and you go to the no smoking area and you can smell the tobacco, and I start to choke. Go into California, California is smoke free all over. It’s great! I can go to any restaurant, any café, any entertainment place, any bar. And, you know what? It’s no smoking, but there’s plenty of people there. It’s kind of some pricey places, and some pop and mom places, we need to get into a healthier environment where everybody can go easily into any public area. I would like you please to support this ordinance so I can visit some of the places that I only read about here. Thank you.
Commissioner Shetler: Thank you, Patricia. Lynda Harris. Then after Lynda is Jack Kirwer.
Lynda Heines: Hi, my name is Lynda Heines. I am a life long resident of Vanderburgh County, Knight Township, and I have a personal issue or a personal thing with this is my dad died of emphysema when I was 17 years old of smoking. We all know now that he didn’t know about the dangers of smoking. What we’re talking about here, we’re talking about a lot of things, but for me we’re talking about a health issue. As a non-smoker, and as child of someone who died of smoking, I’m really concerned about it, and concerned about it for me and also for those, for everyone, but I like to go places. The person before me really stole most of what I was going to say. I recently got back from New Mexico and California where we could go and go to bars, which I also enjoy listening to music, and that kind of thing. Also, going out to eat, and it’s just we don’t, we talk about rights, but I like to be able to pick and choose where I go and not have to eat other people’s smoke. It is a health issue. Second hand smoke is an issue. It is something that we all know now. There’s all kinds of research on it. I really hope that you will say yes to this ordinance. Thank you.
Commissioner Shetler: Thank you. Jack Kirwer, and then James Scott. Jack Kirwer and then James Scott.
Jack Kirwer: I know most of you, but in case you didn’t know I live in Vanderburgh County. I do a lot of things in Evansville. So, I’m concerned about the smoking ban. I think we should have one. Just one of the things that I wanted to mention, I left these papers up with you all, and I think you probably read them, but the bars that are concerned about losing revenue, I think they’re mistaken. They’re just not, haven’t read the reports. New York City they’re, after, in 2003 they enacted a non-smoking ban and they’re up to 8 percent now or 8.7 from the previous year. California, bar receipts have improved every year since the ban was enacted in 1997. I just think that it’s something, maybe they haven’t thought about it, but they actually, the receipts are going up wherever this ban was enacted. I would like to just put my two cents worth and say I hope you do pass it. I do think it should be passed with no exceptions. If you make any exceptions, then they’re going to jump on that. I understand the private clubs. I belong to a private club and they’re very concerned about this, but if you can pass it and exempt them, without all the bars in town turning into private clubs, then that would be a good trick. Thank you.
Commissioner Shetler: Thank you, Jack. James Scott and then Harold Pfender.
James Scott: My name is James Scott. I live in Vanderburgh County, Knight Township. One of the questions I’ve got is this smoking ban, public areas, like, for instance, can you go on a picnic and smoke? Because, or can you not? I mean, it’s a public place. I mean, you can’t cook your burgers, can’t cook your hot dogs, that’s smoke.
Commissioner Shetler: It’s basically in enclosed areas.
James Scott: Now it’s enclosed. Because I was not told this.
Commissioner Shetler: That’s the way it’s been.
James Scott: Because if you look at public, it’s strictly public out places. Okay, then another thing is, is going to lose a lot of capital here. Because, you know, I just got done reading a lot of veteran groups are going to be coming here to see the boat, conventions, it’s a lot of money. A lot of those people smoke. When they find out some of them can’t come, none of them will come. I know, my mom had a business downtown, and she always made money on conventions and when the boat come to town, I mean, the river boats that come to town. We lose a lot. My other factor is, I’m a veteran, and I raised my hand up twice, because when I had to go in the reserves and the regular Army for the Constitution for freedom for all. I was fighting for my rights, fighting for everyone rights, non-smokers and smokers rights. The people that own these businesses it should be their decision what to have in these businesses. It’s not right for someone to come in there and tell them what to do, and how to do it. In fact, I just lost a nephew over there in Iraq who smoked, and, guess what, if he came home and said, “Hey, Robbie, I’m sorry, buddy, you can’t smoke. Although, you sacrificed your life for everyone’s freedom here. You can’t go out to the bar and smoke.” There’s not much time, there’s a lot more stories, I guess, but, anyway I know one guy, him and his wife they were practical, he smokes pipes, he walked out to a park there on a park bench, no one around him, non-smokers purposely walked up to him and sat next to him, “Would you put that pipe out?” Greg said, “Hey, dang it, I’m a Vietnam Veteran, I’m an ex-Marine, and I got wounded twice over there, I fought to have that pipe in my hand to smoke it. If you want to take that out of my hand, by God, there’s going to be a war here.” That’s what he said. Knowing Greg, being an ex-Marine like he was. Like me, I feel the same way. I’m a soldier, and ex-soldier, I’ve, you know, served my country, could have sacrificed my life. My dad smoked. I smoke cigars, basically, but I’m fighting for the people’s rights. When rights are taken away, that’s what gets me. Because if you look at it, alright, smokers go into certain sections of the restaurants, they have to smoke outside Roberts Stadium, they have to smoke here, they’ve given up so much, they agreed, okay, we’re going to give this up, we’re going to give that up, we’re going to give this up and that up. Now, they want to take it all. What’s left? They just want it all. That’s rights taken away. Freedom, people sacrificed their lives for this, and, you know, in fact, this country was founded on tobacco. People don’t realize that. Sir Walter Raleigh, brought tobacco over here, that was the number one, that was the cash crop that was sent back to England and Europe and the Indians, you know. Well, anyway, that’s what I got to say. I believe it’s rights. Rights is being taken away. I don’t like that. I mean, everyone should have rights. That’s the way it should be. That’s what I fought for, everyone’s rights. Not just a handful. Not this group, not that group, but everyone’s rights. Thank you very much.
Commissioner Shetler: Thank you, James. Harold Pfender, and then Sally Britt-Hill.
Harold Pfender? Sally Britt-Hill?
Sally Britt-Hill: Hi, my name is Sally Britt-Hill. I am a resident of Vanderburgh County. I would first like to thank you all for hearing us again tonight. I know you’ve taken a lot out of your personal schedules. You’ve also welcomed us no matter what our opinions are, whether you agree with us or not, and you’ve suffered some personal attacks, and for that I apologize. You deserve better, as we deserve better. Some rules are created for safety. We have crosswalks for the safety of pedestrians crossing the street. We have speed limits, that regulate the speeds that we can travel. This issue should be no different. Rights issues are being brought up time and again, but we all do things that we don’t necessarily like. Health codes are put in place for our safety. We’ve all heard the “No Shirt, No Shoes, No Service”, isn’t it my right to go somewhere not wearing shoes? But, I wear shoes to fit into society and to protect the greater good of the public. What about repealing the rule requiring sneeze shields on salad bars? Isn’t it my right to sneeze wherever I want? No, because it’s for the good of the people. If you sneeze on other people’s foods, it’s become contaminated. Restaurants wear gloves while they’re preparing our food, wear hairnets while they’re preparing our food. These are all health issues. Smoking is also. I have compassion for small business owners, and understand concerns, but other communities have proven that business will survive. It is your duty to make decisions for the public. As elected officials, we’re counting on you to protect the health of all citizens and visitors to our community. Seventy percent of your constituents want a comprehensive ordinance passed, and I urge you to do so. Thank you.
Commissioner Shetler: Thank you. Caroline Nellis, Caroline Nellis, and then Arthur Mengen.
Caroline Nellis: My name is Caroline Nellis, and I’m a resident of Evansville. We’ve heard remarks here tonight, they were written by Theresa Carter, a minority business lady. We also had a nurse who said on the remarks from Theresa, she mentioned that she does not allow her business, anyone, to smoke in it. She chooses a smoke free environment. We heard from a nurse who said she will not patronize any west side establishments anymore because they are smoking establishments. Both of those ladies are making choices. One chooses not to have a business where people smoke. Another one chooses not to support businesses that smoke. That is what America is about, making choices. I support their right to make those choices. I also support the right of other businesses to choose to be smoking establishments, and I support the right of smokers who want to patronize those businesses. This is America. This is a country that was based on the principles that individual choices, and the workings of the marketplace dictate how the country is run. It is not government intervention that makes our lives run their course. We have been a free country, and I think we are watching our freedoms die, falling like dominos in the last few years. I am seeing an America that I never expected to see in my lifetime. From the Federal Executive branch, that in the name of security does domestic wiretapping, data mines our telecommunications, one by one our freedoms are falling. They are dominos, and this is just one more domino.
Commissioner Shetler: After Art Mengen is Rita Mengen.
Arthur Mengen: Good evening. I’m here to promote choice. I’m a former smoker. I’m a resident of Vanderburgh County and a former professional entertainer that’s worked in a lot of smoky restaurants, but perhaps you might consider, instead of restrictions, an incentive for people to do the right thing. My proposal would see a local option tax on tobacco products that would fund tax incentives for businesses that would want to be smoke free and give them incentives to do so. I think that would be a little more creative, let people have the choice to run their business the way they want, but they would be financially rewarded if they went and did the right thing. It would be more of an incentive program, rather than add more restrictions, which, you know, we already have reams and reams of restrictions on the books. But, I think if you hit a guy in his pocketbook in a favorable manner, it would induce him to do the right thing by letting people who want to run their business in maybe a non, or a counter productive manner, do so at their own cost. Just an idea. Thought I would throw it out. Thanks, guys.
Commissioner Shetler: Thank you. Rita Mengen? After Rita is Taryn Bush.
Rita Mengen: Good evening. I’m Rita Mengen. I’m speaking just for myself. I was a smoker for past age 60, and I’m here to tell you how stupid it is to be caught. We had the Lucky Strike Hit Parade, we had all these cool things back in the 40's, cigarettes were 15 cents a pack, and you can do yourself in real quick. I’ve had asthma problems, I’ve had sinus surgery, I get a cold with a bad cough that won’t go away, and I want to remind the people that say our Council cannot make this decision, they seem to have forgotten what representative government is. Thank you.
Commissioner Shetler: Thank you, Rita. Taryn, is it Taryn Bush? Taron? Tabre Yahskinner? Yahskinner, of 218 Madison? Alright, Keiaria Johnson, Culver Drive? Kelli Dempsey?
Kelli Dempsey: Good evening, I’m an oncology nurse practitioner, and I’m here this evening representing, along with two other nurses from our office, our oncology practice, our patients, our families, and several of the medical communities that we interact with. I interact with cancer patients, and their families everyday. It’s a devastating business to be in. I know earlier somebody commented that they owned a restaurant and worked 60 to 70 hours a week, and that sounds about like what the doctor and I put in. I want to say that I have seen the devastations of smoking and second hand smoke on a daily basis. I also have heard a lot about the freedoms of choice, and I’m just not prepared to get in to all of that, except to say that my only son also is serving in the United States Army, he’s an officer over in Kuwait ready to go to his second rotation in Iraq, and we both passionately believe in the right to choose. The right to choose what you want to do to yourself, but not when it causes harm to others. I don’t think anybody’s trying to take away the right to smoke, just not smoking where it could cause a problem to others. Thank you.
Commissioner Shetler: Thank you. Jon Klotz?
(Tape change)
Jon Klotz: First of all, I’m also a non-smoker. I understand that a lot of the cases in democracy the majority is going to rule, and this probably is going to happen, the smoking ban. I do work at a bar here in Evansville, one of the larger bars. I just wanted to say a couple of things; one, about 70 percent of our employees, past, present, historically smoke. Many people go to work in a bar so they can smoke at work while working, on breaks or whatever. So, I understand that a lot of people are saying the workplace, I don’t know that that is applicable to a lot of bars. Restaurants, yes, bars, like I said, I believe a lot of them work there because they can smoke. We are a 21 and over establishment. I just believe that that should be exempt from your ordinance. I think, you could always go back later and try to grab that, but I know when they ran that survey, I noticed it was worded very broadly, “Do you support a smoking ban?” You know, a lot of people would say yes. If you clarified it and said 21 and over bars or patrons of bars, you might get a slightly different response. So, I believe that was a skewed result. But, anyway, like I said, I’m not absolutely against the ordinance anyway, I just believe that the 21 and over exemption shouldn’t be on the table. I think you should concentrate on the people that are, the younger people. People come to our bar to drink. They don’t have to come for any other reason, necessarily, just to eat or what not. But, like I said, I believe that the health issues are true, but most people that come into bars aren’t usually overly concerned with their health. They tend to be there to forget about a lot of things, including their health. But, like I said, I believe the ordinance probably is headed towards passing, but I would ask that you exempt at least the 21 and over establishments that, we never require, we never allow anyone under 21 in the door any time of day from opening to close. I think that would be a prudent measure to do. So, thank you very much for your time.
Commissioner Shetler: Thank you. Polly Bigham, and Karla Sneegas. Yes?
Polly Bigham: Good evening, I’m Polly Bigham, I’m a resident of German Township in Vanderburgh County. I’m a registered voter. I care about cancer issues, and I do vote. The American Cancer Society thanks the Evansville City Council and the Vanderburgh County Commission for actively considering an effective smoke free work place policy to protect the health of our workers and residents. Second hand smoke is an important issue. Smoking not only harms the smoker, it harms those who breathe in second hand smoke, workers who work in smoking work places. Second hand smoke causes many deaths from heart disease every year. Even relatively low exposure significantly increases the risk of heart disease. Second hand smoke is responsible for 12,000 cancer deaths, 3,000 from lung cancer, annually. You’ve heard the statistics, but I don’t think anyone has mentioned yet that there’s a lot of good news about cancer and surviving cancer, but there’s not good news about lung cancer. There’s no screening for early detection of lung cancer. We don’t have that now. So, it’s really important to think about that issue. The only way to truly protect the health of workers or patrons from second hand smoke is a comprehensive smoke free ordinance covering all work places. It is important to understand that in many public places and work sites, workers in Vanderburgh County are regularly exposed to hazardous cancer causing chemicals from second hand smoke, and you can do something about that. We have the opportunity to do something about health and safety. We recognize that compromise is part of the legislative process, however, the City of Evansville and Vanderburgh County should not adopt a compromised smoke fee ordinance that allows for the use of smoking rooms, separation of smokers and non-smokers, or ventilation. We cannot support compromises that have been proven not to protect the health and prevent future progress. Smoking rooms and ventilation mistakenly provide our citizens with a false sense of security, and suggest their health is still being protected, when, in fact, it is not. No one should have to choose between a paycheck and their health. Smoke free ordinances protect all workers from the health hazards of second hand smoke, without hurting business. The American Cancer Society supports everyone’s right to breathe smoke free air, and we urge the City Council, we urge you to vote for this ordinance. Thank you very much.
Commissioner Shetler: Thank you, Polly. Karla Sneegas, Karla Sneegas, and then Susan Harp.
Karla Sneegas: Good evening. My name is Karla Sneegas, I’m the Executive Director for Indiana Tobacco Prevention and Cessation. We are the State agency that’s responsible for implementing Indiana’s Comprehensive Tobacco Prevention and Cessation Program. First, I would like to congratulate you for the courage to talk about this issue, and to educate the public about this issue. It is highly critical for our entire state. Tobacco is a huge burden for Indiana, and it’s a huge burden for your own economy here in southwest Indiana. Last year the Indiana Hospital Association released a study that was commissioned and conducted by Price Waterhouse. It showed that Indiana has one of the top five health care costs burdens in the nation, and that smoking is one of the primary reasons that our health care costs are escalating and out of control. We do have choices, as has been pointed out, and I think that we have a choice in Indiana to make our economy healthier. You have a choice about making your environment healthier so that more businesses will decide to come to Evansville, to Vanderburgh County, and to make this their home. These types of companies are looking at the health of the community when they make these decisions. In fact, the Indiana Economic Development Plan that was recently released, if you want to take a look at page 28 of that plan, it suggests that as an incentive, communities pass local smoke free air laws as an incentive for bringing business to your community. Just a couple of facts and figures I would like to add to your thoughts as you debate this issue. A lot of the workers that are not protected are the workers that are in the hospitality industry. A lot of those are women of child bearing age. In Indiana, there are 900 low birth weight babies born every year by women who are exposed to second hand smoke. In Indiana, there are 11,000 cases of asthma every year, costing us $9,000,000 from exposure to second hand smoke. Recently, a new report showed that women, pre-menopausal women, women of child bearing age are at a higher risk for breast cancer because of their exposure to second hand smoke. There have been local laws passed in Indiana, 18 of them to date, Seymour was the last, last night. We now have about 30 percent of Indiana’s population that is covered by local smoke free air laws, and I look forward to Evansville and Vanderburgh County being the next. Thank you.
Commissioner Shetler: Hold on just a minute.
Councilman Melcher: Do you live in Indianapolis? Where are you from?
Karla Sneegas: I live in Indianapolis. I work for the State agency that handles the tobacco program.
Councilman Melcher: What have you done, what has your group done on the State level, or the State legislators? Because some states have passed this. Where do you stand with them right now?
Karla Sneegas: That’s a really good question. What is happening at the State level regarding this type of policy? The experience nationally is that states usually are not able to pass state-wide legislation until there are numerous local policies, like the one you’re debating passed. I’ll use Massachusetts as an example. Massachusetts passed a state-wide smoke free air law in 2004. They had 90 municipal laws on the books for smoke free air laws before they considered passing that law. So, the really important part is, of course, the entire public education process that takes place, and that is done best when it’s at the local level. So, I think, eventually, we’ll see that type of thing in Indiana, but it’s probably a while off. Meanwhile, local economies can certainly take advantage of the opportunity to move forward.
Commissioner Shetler: Alright, thank you.
Karla Sneegas: Thank you very much.
Commissioner Shetler: Theresa Oser, no, I’m sorry, Susan, Susan Harp, and then Theresa Oser.
Susan Harp: Susan Harp, I’m a resident of the city. I’ve talked to most of you before on this issue. So, I’m coming to you today because the kindergartners I teach asked me to come talk to you, because they know that I am active in these kind of affairs. They said their parents will not listen to them. They ask their parents not to smoke, their parents tell them I’m the grown up, you’re the child, I do what I wish to do. That is true, but these children don’t have a choice. When they go to a restaurant, their parents take them there, they don’t have a choice. I think we need to look out for those. They are our future. These children also said that it would be nice if you could ban smoking in vehicles, because that’s a problem also. The other group I want to talk about are the 21 and 23 year olds. I heard some oohs and aahs in the crowd because I was talking about young children. But, I want to talk to you about the 21 and 23 year olds that I’ve had conferences with lately. They cruise Green River Road in the evenings. I’ve been on several ride-a-longs with the City Police when they were stopped for other violations. They were asked, you know, we were curious after we like car load after car load of these age brackets, why aren’t you out at the bars? They were not at the bars, because they did not like to smoke. They had nowhere to go. So, they cruised Green River. Now, the other one is that my father was a tavern owner, he was a non-smoker, he would have liked, very much, to have had this ordinance passed, if this were in his county, because he loved the drinking part of it, and he loved the socializing, but he didn’t like the smoke. As a former smoker, I can tell you, 16 years ago I would have been sitting right here with these people, you kind of build this barrier, and you don’t realize until it’s too late. So, I’m asking you on behalf of the younger children who cannot make decisions, cannot choose where they go because their parents take them, and also for the upcoming future 21, 23 year olds to give them places to go where they don’t have to sit in the smoke. Thank you very much.
Commissioner Shetler: Thank you, Susan. Theresa, Theresa Oser, Oser. Taraya Bush, or, I’m sorry.
Unidentified: What was the last name?
Commissioner Shetler: O-s-e-r. Alright, I’m sorry, I probably butchered that. If that’s, I apologize.
Theresa Oser: My name is Theresa Oser. I’m a resident of the City of Evansville. I have a list here of some of the things that are found in cigarette smoke; ammonia, hydrogen cyanide gas, some kind of acid I can’t pronounce. Oh, wait a minute, those are the things found in death chamber gasses. What do you know, they’re also found in cigarette smoke. Nicotine is the most addictive, well, nicotine is more addictive than heroine or cocaine or alcohol. There have been a few people say that you can’t smoke within 40 feet of a building, you can’t smoke in your car, if it’s on the building property, nothing in the ordinance says that. It does say, section two, chapter 8.42.02, number A12 says, “within a reasonable distance outside an enclosed area”. So, the smoke can’t get into the building. If a person is so controlled by their drug addiction, that they can’t even make it to the door to smoke outside, then maybe they should try rehab in lieu of poisoning everyone else around them in the restaurant, or wherever they happen to be. I would also like to address the freedom of choice, I don’t quite understand this, some of the things I’ve been hearing, an example I used last week at the meeting was, why not make drunk driving legal? The rest of us can just choose not to drive. There’s a line between the freedom to choose and lawlessness. The freedom to choose does not include negligence, conduct in reckless disregard of another’s rights, bodily injury, serious bodily injury, or attempted manslaughter. You know what, it sounds to me like cigarette smoking in public places is already illegal. As far as the businesses go, I went to have dinner with my grandson, my nine month old grandson, at a restaurant who allows smoking, I thought just in the bar. We were seated next to a couple who had two toddlers. Another couple came in and sat near our table and proceeded to chain smoke, in spite of the fact that there were three infants right beside them. They didn’t care. There’s no such thing as common courtesy when it comes to people wanting to breathe clean air versus people who want to smoke. I agree that there should be an even playing field for the business owners. You can ban smoking across the board, or maybe allow for separate, separation of restaurants with bars by separate and independent ventilation. I just don’t understand, after knowing all of this, and seeing all of these, how can anyone possibly believe that they have the right to poison the air that I am breathing, and that the children and other people of this city are breathing? Thank you very much.
Commissioner Shetler: Thank you. Tara Bush? Robert, is it Rith? It looks like R-I-z-h, I’m sorry.
Robert Riethe: I write like a doctor. My name is Rob Riethe, I live here in Vanderburgh County. Thank you for allowing me to speak to you today. I was asked to speak a little bit about second hand smoke. It’s a difficult decision that the community here has in front of them and our leaders, but I think it’s one worth making. What do we know about cigarette smoking? Well, tobacco smoke is directly linked to lung cancer. In fact, it causes about 90 percent of the causes of lung cancer. Lung cancer itself is the leading cause of cancer death in the United States, in both men and women. Unfortunately, it’s a battle that we’re losing. I deal with these patients almost every day. What about smoking in the home? Second hand smoke in the home has been shown to cause an increased risk of COPD, which is a combination of emphysema and chronic bronchitis, and lung cancer in the home. What about in the small businesses? Well, there have been some information and studies that have shown that in businesses that there’s a lot of passive smoking. Those individuals that are exposed are at increased risk of those disorders, namely bartenders, waiters and waitresses. You know, since I’m a relative new attending, one of the most difficult things I’ve had to do as an attending, is to tell one of my patients and their family that they have inoperable lung cancer. When I look in to their eyes, I see finally the realization that this could happen to me, and now their lives are cut short. It’s a terrible situation. So, what should we do? You know, tobacco smoke is a toxin. I think we should try and break the chain of disease in all areas. We should attempt to try and encourage people to stop smoking. We should encourage people to stop smoking in their homes, because of people in the home are directly affected by the smoke, such as the women and children and the rest of the family. Lastly, I do believe that trying to quit smoking and stop smoking exposure in the environment can only help our community. I think in the process we’ll save lives, and I think we’ll make a community which is already very beautiful, even better. So, thank you.
Commissioner Shetler: Thank you. Bookie Buchenberger, and then after that it’s Ralph Meckley. Bookie Buchenberger? Ralph Meckley?
Ralph Meckley: Good evening. I applaud you gentleman and ladies for sitting here and listening to this. This can’t be very pleasant. I would ask that the public remember the missing in action people here. Apparently, they just don’t care. But, you know, I’ve heard a lot tonight, and it’s been a real education. I heard the veteran card played, my father was a veteran, three of my cousins were veterans, I spent six years in the Marine Corp. Unfortunately, my father and my three cousins are all dead from lung cancer. You know, those little cigarettes they’re talking about? That’s called a marketing ploy. It gets you started, and you keep going. My mother used to be a heavy smoker. She quit, right after she had a heart attack. So, what’s to think about? I mean, I’m really struggling trying to figure out what is even the debate. If I choose to go to a restaurant, I love the Deerhead, love scotch and water, and that red beans and rice, just to die for. But, basically, every time I go there, it’s like somebody is taking, oh, let’s say, arsenic, and putting it in my food, so I’m eating a little bit of it. Not enough to kill me right away, but as time goes along. Well, if this officer seen that, and he seen that happening, he would have to do his duty, wouldn’t he? I’m simply asking you to do the same thing. I have a choice of going to the Deerhead or not going to the Deerhead. I don’t go most of the time. If I do, I sit outside, because I can’t tolerate the inside, okay? It’s simple. I hear these veterans clubs and the rest of the clubs saying that they can’t, they don’t want this, because it’s going to kill their business. I really have a hard time understanding that, because I don’t go there simply because I’ve got to be able to breathe. That’s my choice, but how many other people are doing just the same thing I am. I guess, what very simply I’m asking is that you do your duty. You have the right to protect people’s freedom, but you also have the duty to protect their lives. This is a choice that you have to make. It’s not an easy one. I hear about the freedom of somebody wearing a seatbelt, he thinks he ought to be able to do that, not do that. That’s fine. Don’t give him the right to unbuckle mine. That’s all I ask. Thank you.
Councilman Melcher: Do you live in the city or the county?
Commissioner Shetler: Ann Beal, and then Richard Cannon? Ann Beal, Richard Cannon. Ann Beal? Alright, Richard? After Richard is Fred Willman. We have just a few more to go, and I know we’re right at 8:00, we have about four more to go, so.
Richard Cannon: I’ll cut mine real short. Richard Cannon. I’m glad to see a united, consolidated effort here. That’s an inside joke. I graduated from pharmacy school a long time ago, before the Cuban missile crisis, if anybody knows their trivia. Since that time there have been a lot of scientific advances. We could talk forever about what they’ve done in science and medicine. The life expectancy when I got out of college was 64, now it’s 76, maybe, and going up everyday. Open heart surgery was just a dream at that time. My oldest son had a very rare form of cancer that he was the second child cured in America because of modern technology and science. We didn’t know when I was in college the danger of cigarettes, and in 1962 the Surgeon General made his first report that smoking was harmful to your health, which about killed me because John Wayne smoked, and I wanted to be like the Duke. As time went on it became more and more evident that smoking was very dangerous to your health, and I had a heck of a time trying to quit. I finally did, and then in 19, the late ‘70's they discovered that second hand smoke was not only as bad as smoking, but worse. Because the smoke coming out of the end of the cigarette is not filtered like the smoke going in your lungs. As a matter of fact, it has a hundred times more tar and poison than the smoke going down your throat. I don’t like government interference, I had bought a nursing home years and years ago that didn’t have a sprinkler, wide hallways, fire escapes, we had people upstairs with no elevators, and the government didn’t mind telling us what to do. We did it, but it was for the health of the patients. The man talked about the Bible, Acts and Romans both talk about obeying and relying on your government. That’s what I think we’re doing. In almost every case except the speed limit on the Lloyd, I agree with. So, I think you have the knowledge, you know, there’s no question about smoking, the dangers, they talk about you can go somewhere where they don’t smoke, well, I don’t know where that would be. I would just add one thought that you might give these guys a year to work out something, some period of time where you don’t just say, okay, tomorrow it’s over, but work with these tavern owners and try to work out some kind of a system that they can grandfather it in for a while. Thank you.
Commissioner Shetler: Alright, thank you, Dick. Fred Willman, and then after that is Martha Caine.
Fred Willman: Good evening. My name is Fred Willman and I own one of the most competitive businesses you can possibly get into, the bar and food business. There’s ads in the paper everyday, somebody will cut you down for a quarter. If smoking was not good for my business, I would eliminate smoking. But, I have about 70 percent of my clientele at night that smoke. So, do I want to get rid of 70 percent of the business? No. There’s enough non-smokers in this room to open two restaurants, if that was popular. We collect taxes, we try to follow the law. I’m working on keeping I.D.’s checked, people that don’t get too drunk, this is one more obligation that I have to take to keep somebody from lighting up a cigarette if this ordinance passes. All I ask is you go 21 and over. I don’t care what you all do, just let me run my own business, that’s it. Thank you.
Commissioner Shetler: Thank you, Fred. Martha Caine, and then after Martha is Denise Bartholomew.
Martha Caine: I’m Martha Caine, and I live in downtown Evansville. I’m representing the Tobacco Prevention and Cessation Coalition in Posey and Gibson counties. I’m here tonight to encourage the City of Evansville and Vanderburgh County to be leaders in public health policy in southwestern Indiana by passing a comprehensive smoke free work place, restaurant and bar ordinance. Elected officials in your neighboring counties of Posey County and Gibson County are watching very closely for the outcome of this ordinance. I have no doubt that what you do here will be a strong influence on whether or not Gibson County and Posey County will enact a smoke free ordinance. I would like to give you a perspective on the scope of the smoke free workplace movement, and the effect that it’s having across the country. According to the Americans for Non-Smokers Rights there are ten states with state laws in effect that require 100 percent smoke free restaurants and bars. There are 2,216 local smoke free laws in effect throughout the United States. Many of the top tourist destinations throughout the United States are smoke free, including; Boston, New York, San Francisco, and Los Angeles. Studies conducted in these cities have concluded that tourism has not gone down after the passage of clean indoor air laws. Tourism is actually going up in these cities. Attracting people to our region and retaining our many college students here is going to prove difficult, if these people can go elsewhere and avoid the dangers and personal intrusion of tobacco smoke in public places. If we don’t keep up with more progressive areas of the country, we can not expect to grow and thrive. IUPUI announced last week that there campus is going entirely smoke free. This is a sign of the times and a sign of what young people, what young college age students want. So, I strongly encourage you, be a leader and an example for this part of our state, and do what is best for our economy, and enact an ordinance that will protect all workers, including those who work in bars. Thank you.
Commissioner Shetler: Martha, do you live in Evansville? Did you say? Alright. Denise?
Denise Bartholomew: My name is Denise Bartholomew, and I’m a resident of Vanderburgh County and live in the county. I’m a former smoker, and have been smoke free for 12 years. I’m also a veteran. For the last eight years I have taught smoking cessation classes, and have lead the only quit smoking support group in our area. Obviously, I empathize with the plight of the smoker. I understand the deep addiction that nicotine has over smokers. I have read all the letters to the editor in the Courier, and I attended the first hearing for this proposed ordinance last Thursday. As we have all seen and heard, there is deep emotion and high passion on this topic. I am in strong support of this no smoking ban, and I want to make sure you understand, truly understand how it feels for the non-smoker who cannot tolerate second hand smoke who lives in Evansville, Indiana. The smoker has absolute free reign in Evansville. They can go anywhere they choose, anytime they choose, they only need to step outside to smoke if it is a non-smoking establishment. They still get to socialize, eat dinner, listen to music and dance. Every 20 to 45 minutes they will need to step outside and smoke. Then they get to come back in. A minor inconvenience. I, however, along with numerous friends and family members who cannot tolerate second hand smoke, am limited as to where I can go. It’s a Friday night, we would like to go to the Deerhead and listen to jazz, nope, can’t go there. How about the new Club Royale off of Franklin that has some great music and bands? Nope, can’t go there. How about a pizza and game of darts at Smitty’s? Nope, tried that. How about some chicken wings at Buffalo Wild Wings? Uh-uh. We have to think long and hard where to go. If we choose to go to the smoking establishments, we all pay the price with labored breathing, burning eyes and scratchy throat, which usually carries over into the next day. I also want to address a recent letter to the editor where a bar owner states that while she doesn’t smoke, she is against the ordinance. According to the University of California Berkeley School of Public Health, for every two hours you are in a smoky restaurant, you have smoked four cigarettes. So, to the non-smoking bar owner or employee who puts in an eight hour shift, you are smoking close to a pack of cigarettes. You are indeed a smoker. Just not the kind who inhales the smoke from the end of the cigarette. Finally, I would ask you to contemplate this, pretend for a moment there is no smoking. The cigarette was never invented. Say someone tried to introduce it today into our society, do you think it would get legalized? If not, why not? I’ll tell you why not, lighting just one cigarette in a room violates the Clean Air Act. I know it’s legal, but because it was legalized a couple hundred years ago doesn’t mean it was ever right. We just didn’t kn