The Vanderburgh County Board of Commissioners and Common Council of the City of Evansville met in a joint workshop format on this 9^th day of June, 2011 at 5:3 p.m. in room 301 of the Civic Center Complex for the purpose of addressing potential modifications to the Evansville-Vanderburgh County Plan of Reorganization.

President Winnecke: Good evening. I would like to call to order our joint workshop of the Vanderburgh County Board of Commissioners and the Evansville Common Council. We’ll begin with the Pledge of Allegiance please.

President Winnecke: Before we get to the business at hand, for those of you who don’t know, City Clerk Alberta Matlock suffered a tragic death in her family. Her son was killed two nights ago. I think to recognize that, I would like to take a moment of silence just to keep her and her family in our thoughts.

President Winnecke: Okay, a couple of things, first on the law enforcement...as the Chief walks in, we were, he and the Sheriff are still working on language that we’d asked for to discuss potential jurisdictional issues. So, that will not be forthcoming at this meeting.

President Winnecke: One of the other outstanding issues is boards and organizations and the appointments. We have the lengthy, but detailed, great information sheet that the legal counsel provided to us last week. So, we’ll begin there. I don’t know who would like to start.

Councilmember McGinn: I would just like to make one, add one bit of information. On page two, at least the way I have it, board number five, the Board of Parks, shows compensation no, but they do receive $3,000 a year.

President Winnecke: Okay, thank you. If anyone needs extra copies of that, I do happen to have some. Does everyone have a copy that needs one? Do we need extra copies? Okay.

Commissioner Abell: Well, I’ll just say, to start it that we might as well skip everything that’s State statute. There’s nothing we can do about it anyway. So, let’s just address the ones on city ordinances.

President Winnecke: There you go. I agree. That would begin with the Advisory Board on Disability Services. The Reorganization Plan calls for a total of seven, four appointed by the Mayor, three by the Council. Our legal counsel says this is, this would not be compliance with–

Commissioner Abell: Because we’ll be changing all of the ordinances anyway, in the event we change government?

Commissioner Abell: Alright. Well, I have a little knowledge of Disability Services, only that I have been to a couple of their meetings and I’ve talked to some of them. My information is that they don’t actually have any direct authority to spend any money. Is that correct?

Commissioner Abell: Then, I have no problem, I don’t know how differently else feels, but if they don’t, if they’re not going to be making official differently on behalf of the city and county government, and not spending any taxpayer money, I don’t have any problem with the way it is.

John Hamilton: And, any of these that are by ordinance can always be changed by ordinance by the Metro Council, if the Metro Council decides to do that, regardless of what you do in this Plan.

Councilmember McGinn: I just want to echo what Commissioner Abell said. My concern is spending money without representation by an elected official. So, again, on boards such as this, I have no problem with the constitution. Again, we can always change it.

Commissioner Abell: Is that under, is Animal Control under Transportation Services?

President Watts: Do you want to see if there are questions on each page (Inaudible. Microphone not on.).

President Winnecke: Okay, yeah. President Watts had a good point, otherwise it’s going to be a very long night. Maybe we’ll just start by page and see if there are issues on each page. On this page is the Animal, just for those watching at home or in the audience, is Animal Control and Education, which is a city ordinance. That’s the only other one on this page.

Commissioner Abell: I do have a question about one that is by statute and that’s the Board of Health.

Commissioner Abell: Since, if we have reorganization, reorganized government there will be no Commissioners, how will that become four Mayor and three Council? Will that have to be State legislation change? How does that change?

John Hamilton: No, I believe, our interpretation is that, since that was an executive appointment, we have over there requirement for compliance with statue is all Mayor. Since the current is all Commissioners, which is executive, we believe that to require, to meet the requirement it would be all Mayor and it would just happen by adoption of this Plan. I don’t believe it will take a change in State statute.

Commissioner Abell: Well, I have an issue with the Health Department then, because they spend a tremendous amount of money. They have their own budget. We on the Council, on the county side have dealt with them for a long time on County Council regarding, you know, where they are, their rent, and all of their expenditures. They have their own taxing entity, but, am I correct on that? They have their own taxing entity? Correct?

John Hamilton: I’ve not looked at that issue. I mean, I’ve looked at the statute and it is manda.....right now what it reads is the County Executive shall appoint the members of a local Board of Health, and that’s State statute. So, I think it would be the executive, unless you get a change at the State level.

Commissioner Abell: Well, if we can’t, you know, if we’re stuck with the statute, we’re stuck. I just would like to point out that that’s a lot of money that they spend. Isn’t that correct, Lloyd, that they have their own–

Commissioner Melcher: So, that means we’re going to say it’s going to be all Mayor?

President Winnecke: Well, what Mr. Hamilton just said is the statute requires that it’s all appointed by the executive.

President Winnecke: Okay. Page two, we have the Board of Parks, Board of Zoning Appeals, the Building Authority Board of Trustees, Burdette Park Advisory Board, Central Dispatch. In that two are by local ordinance, that would be the Burdette Park Advisory Board and Central Dispatch. Any questions on those two?

Councilmember McGinn: I do, Mr. President. The question I have is, do we want to allow three of the boards out of the 60 to remain compensated or no? Parks Board was, they make $3,000 a year, that’s, I don’t think by State statute, because the board was in existence for years and years and years before they received any compensation. So, Public Works, Safety and Parks Board, I think, or, well, Water a different entity pays them. That comes from revenues, but, I mean, that’s the issue. Why do these people receive money? We’re looking for citizen volunteers, you know, if we want to decrease some strength in the executive, which again, I don’t know what anyone’s personal preference is, but not having pay seems to, I would think would make members of a board more neutral, less able to be influenced, at least theoretically.

President Winnecke: My only source of reference on that is the Area Plan Commission. I’ve served on that and those members are not compensated. That is a large, they have a lot of responsibility.

Councilmember McGinn: I mean, you know, the other side of the coin is, gee, let’s compensate everyone, but if a portion of this reorganization is to try to consolidate services and save money. I mean, I know people that would be willing to serve on boards without compensation just, you know, to do their public service. You know, I have friends on boards who are receiving payment. So, they’re not going to be real happy with this.

President Winnecke: John, on the issue of the Parks Board, since it’s created by State statute, does statute require compensation?

John Hamilton: I don’t believe it does. I’m not sure of the source, whether it was by county or city ordinance or both, but I don’t think we have that. But, if you take a straw vote and decide you don’t want it we can certainly find out and follow those wishes if we’re able to, and if we’re not able to we would report it to you.

Councilmember Bredhold: I will say as a new member of the Council, the first time we went through the budgetary process I was sort of surprised to see that some members of boards are paid while so many other aren’t, and wasn’t sure what the rhyme or reason was there and questioned whether that might be someplace where we could save some money. It’s not much, but some.

President Watts: If we’re going to address this one here now, do we want to go ahead and say if we’re not going to compensate them, there’s going to be no compensation for any board that we have? Is that a fair statement?

Commissioner Abell: But, I think we might want to consider reimbursing expenses, especially for things like Area Plan. If they get in their car and they drive around and look at all those places and we want to encourage them to do that, at four dollars a gallon that becomes pretty expensive for some of those people. I think it would be a good idea to have them, have the freedom to turn in an expense sheet showing where they went and then reimburse them for their expenses.

Councilmember McGinn: I would agree with that. You’re not talking about lunches?

Commissioner Abell: No, I’m not talking about lunches. No Christmas parties, just mileage.

Councilmember McGinn: Yeah, who would have thought at four dollars a gallon how important this is, but, yeah, I agree too, four bucks a gallon.

President Watts: So, the motion would be that any board that is compensated, the compensation will be removed, bar mileage expenses for duties that they are doing that involve that board appointment. All those in favor signify by saying aye.

(Straw vote was passed by County Council 9-0. County Commissioners approved straw vote 3-0 by raising their hands. No audible vote was taken.)

President Winnecke: Okay, that’s one change we can make now. Still on page two, Burdette Park Advisory Board or Central Dispatch. Any questions.

Commissioner Abell: Any chance Burdette Park will go under the Parks Department, if we have Consolidated Government?

President Winnecke: It is, but there are also, the Plan also calls for the Advisory Board to remain in tact, if I remember correctly.

Commissioner Abell: Is there any reason? I mean, they’re not in tact right now.

President Winnecke: It’s not been active for three years, four years maybe. I can’t tell you why.

President Watts: So, you’re saying if it comes under the Parks Board there’s not a need, all of their things would be addressed by the Parks Board as opposed to–

Commissioner Abell: Well, I’m assuming that Burdette Park will be treated just like all of the other parks when it comes to expenses and funding. So, I don’t see why they would need their own board.

President Winnecke: Yeah, let’ straw poll, straw vote on Burdette Park being eliminated, Advisory Board rather, not the park, the Advisory Board. Show of hands. Anyone opposed? Okay.

(The straw vote was approved by County Council 9-0 and County Commissioners 3-0.)

Councilmember Adams: (Inaudible. Microphone not on.) I don’t know whether that’s important (Inaudible. Microphone not on.).

Councilmember McGinn: I’m on that board right now, and we really do, as a non-service member of that board, the Police and the Fire and the Sheriff, I mean, they’re the ones who deal with this everyday. They know what’s going on. So, as long as those representatives are there, then, I think, the other two people can add some new ideas and that type of thing. But, it’s pretty specialized, at least what I’ve figured out so far.

Councilmember McGinn: So, I think seven is fine, compared to, from my experience. Wendy, you were on it for a year, what do you think?

Councilmember Bredhold: The reason that it’s less is because the Police Chief isn’t included in the Reorganization Plan. That’s why the number is–

President Winnecke: But, what the attorneys are saying, to be in compliance with the ordinance, and we could change the ordinance, they’re suggesting that it remain at nine, with two appointments by the Mayor, two by the Council, the Police Chief, one by the Police Chief, one by the Sheriff, one by the Fire Chief, one by the Suburban Fire Chief, Emergency Management. Seems to me that’s a better representation than what is proposed.

President Winnecke: Okay, do we want to take a straw vote on the total of nine with the breakdown; two by the Mayor, two by the Council, one by the Police Chief, one by the Sheriff, one by the Fire Chief, Suburban Chief, and one by Emergency Management. Show of hands. Anybody opposed?

(The straw vote was approved by County Council 9-0 and County Commissioners 3-0.)

President Winnecke: Okay. Page three, there are three of the four on this page that are City ordinance; Coalition to End Homelessness, Code Enforcement Hearing Authority Board, and the Commission on the Social Status of African American Males. John, on the, on the Coalition to End Homelessness, it says 16 total enumerated in ordinance. So, I assume that is totally different than what the Reorganization Plan–

Councilmember McGinn: I’m on that board too. You’re right, there’s an exchange of ideas–

Councilmember McGinn: –this is a flow of information that’s never happened before. These groups are coordinating their efforts, and they’re very, very pleased with what has happened over the last few years–

Councilmember McGinn: – there’s groups that didn’t even talk, meet together–

Councilmember McGinn: -so, yeah, I mean, 16, I mean, that’s just more information to be shared to make this thing possible.

President Winnecke: Yeah, it seems to me that we should, if reorganization passed, and that’s too many, I guess we could always amend the ordinance, but it seems to me that we would want to keep it the way it is.

Councilmember McGinn: Yeah, unless people on that board have some objections, but I cannot imagine that they would. They’re, it’s really working very well. You were on it.

Councilmember Bredhold: Yeah, I agree with you, Councilman. I think that should stay the same–

John Hamilton: They’re mainly positions; the Mayor, a County Commissioner selected by the Commissioners, a City Councilman selected by the City Council, a County Councilman selected by Council, a person appointed by PPCHS, Director of the Department of Family and Children, a member of the Evansville-Vanderburgh School Corporation, a member appointed by the governing body of Work One, a person appointed by the Board of Commissioners who was previously a homeless person at some point, a person appointed by the Mayor of the City of Evansville who is a landlord in Vanderburgh County, the Director of the Housing Authority, a person appointed by the Board of Commissioners who is a credit counselor, the Director of Southwestern Mental Health, the Director of the Department of Metropolitan Development, a person appointed by the Mayor who works in the area of vocational rehab, and the Director of the Human Relations Commission.

Commissioner Melcher: See, if you listen to that, it pretty much covers the gamut of what it is. That’s why it needs to stay that.

President Winnecke: I would agree. Let’s, since it’s different from what’s proposed in the Reorganization Plan, let’s go ahead and take a straw vote. Everybody in favor of keeping it the way it is raise their hand. Anyone opposed? Okay.

(The straw vote was approved by County Council 9-0 and County Commissioners 3-0.)

Councilmember Adams: Well, I’m on the Commission of the Social Status of African American Males, and the attendance is very, very spotty. About four or five people show up, and I wondered, and I defer to my colleague, whether it could be folded into the Human Relations Board in terms of....I mean, people don’t show up to it.

Councilmember Robinson: That’s one of the problems (Inaudible. Microphone not on.) people don’t come to them.

President Watts: Yeah, when you have 15 people it’s going to be pretty difficult to–

Councilmember Robinson: Well, we have problems trying to find people that are interested in being a member.

Commissioner Abell: That causes problems with the board to function, because if they don’t have a quorum–

Councilmember Robinson: It probably (Inaudible. Microphone not on.) It’s a part of the Human Relations Commission.

Councilmember Robinson: It’s almost like a feel good board. I mean, we did have a barber shop health fair that was outstanding.

Councilmember Robinson: It could be part of Human Relations, it’s a function of the Human Relations Commission.

Commissioner Melcher: They actually take the minutes and that if I remember right, because I sat on that board. Don’t they take the minutes and set the meetings up and everything?

Councilmember Robinson: I think it would probably be more effective if we did reduce the number of people.

Councilmember Adams: I just want it to be more effective. I mean, I’ve come down three or four times, I’ve showed up three or four times, don’t have a quorum so we just sit around and, I mean.....and, I agree, that one project was excellent.

Commissioner Melcher: Well, in the beginning we had a couple bus trips up to Indianapolis for a couple different events.

Councilmember Robinson: It just has ideas but no money to implement anything. So, they usually have to wait on some kind of special grant or funding from something at the State that might be available.

Commissioner Melcher: And, right now, non-profits, I know last time, I know one time CAPE even donated some money and some other people, and all of them are getting cut. So, you’re not going to see non-profits donate too much money here.

President Winnecke: So, I hear two things; one either reduce the size of the current board or eliminate it and fold it into Human Relations. So, what’s the pleasure?

Councilmember Adams: Would you recommend review for the implementation of the merged government? That would give them a couple of years to see whether the cut down of numbers helped.

Councilmember Robinson: Just like Commissioner Melcher said, they depend on a lot of non-for-profit agencies to donate money so that they can do programs, and with the cut in funding from non-profit agencies, they don’t have money to do anything.

Commissioner Melcher: When I was on it, a lot of us that were appointed, we donated money. So, it needs, for it to work it needs money behind it, and that’s where the Human Relations could come in. So, I think going down to seven you could surely have a quorum, because we always had a hard time getting a quorum. I would think, Connie was right, we’re better off starting it with that–

Commissioner Melcher: –and then as we get to that point, then it would be understood.

President Winnecke: Okay, so a motion to reduce the number to seven total appointments; three by the Mayor, four by the Council. Everybody in favor raise their hand. Anybody opposed?

(The straw vote was approved by County Council 9-0 and County Commissioners 3-0.)

Commissioner Melcher: I would like to add, this might be a good time for the City Council maybe to look at this and go ahead and do that, you know, for next year and that so they could get started and see what it does, before we even vote on consolidation.

Commissioner Melcher: Because, I think, why sit there with 15 the next two years when, just think about it.

President Winnecke: Okay, next page, page four. Two on this that have, are under the purview of local ordinance. The first is the Construction and Roofing License Review Board.

President Winnecke: We’ll get there. Any suggestions on this page, on that one or the CVB?

Commissioner Abell: What does it mean, the Mayor determines the number of members and who makes the appointments?

John Hamilton: The State statutory language is that the executive shall determine the number of members, which must be an odd number, to be appointed to the commission. Then it does have some qualifications such as a simple majority of the members must be engaged in the convention and visitor tourism business and some other requirements such as that.

Commissioner Abell: Well, but then they recommended four Mayoral and three Council, but yet there’s, so their recommendation does not fit State requirements?

John Hamilton: We’re telling you it does not comply with the State statute, and statutory language, I mean, it would be spelled out more in detail than that, but we didn’t repeat the entire statute, but that’s the gist of it.

Commissioner Abell: I think, right now, CVB has a lot more members than that on the board.

Commissioner Abell: County Commissioners have two, the County Council have two, does City Council have any?

John Hamilton: – is who determined whatever the make up is now, according to this statute.

President Winnecke: The current statute? You’re just saying in a reorganized form of government, aren’t you, John?

John Hamilton: Okay, is this strictly in Evansville? Okay, the executive of the municipality shall appoint a number of members of the....I want to clarify this, because the way I’m reading this, is there a tax levied under a section for the Evansville Convention and Visitors Bureau?

President Winnecke: They don’t levy it. I mean, as, like we, like any of our bodies would, but they oversee a tax.

Commissioner Melcher: I would think since the County Council’s is making appointments, I don’t know why the Metro Council can’t make appointments.

Commissioner Abell: I agree. This board is definitely a board that needs representation.

John Hamilton: Yeah, I mean, if you tell us what you want, we’ll determine if you can do it. The statute I’m reading is not (Inaudible).

Councilmember Adams: I knew you would. Is this the place where we decide whether various boards report to the Metro Council with their decisions on how they spend all of this money?

President Winnecke: Well, the way it’s organized now, the CVB’s budget is presented annually to the County Council. So, I guess, the question for John and Kathryn would be, in a reorganized form of government, would the CVB present its budget to the Metro Council?

Councilmember Adams: But, you’re talking about budget, I’m talking about awarding various millions to various projects, which wouldn’t necessarily be in the budget.

President Winnecke: Well, and the County Council has, they bring, those approvals come to the County Council now.

President Winnecke: As the projects occur. The CVB, the local board, the CVB decides, yes, they want to do it, and then they bring it to the County Council for approval.

Councilmember Adams: So, we should, or we do have to put it in for the Metro Council?

Councilmember McGinn: I mean, I would hope they were in, because we’ve all been through budget processes where when you’re doing the budget for the upcoming year there’s a lump sum, you know, “x” hundreds of thousands of dollars for–

Councilmember McGinn: – projects, you know, and then we don’t know what these little projects are. So, the way the CVB works now with County Council, when they come up they enumerate those projects, we know what dollars out of that lump sum we approved or spent. So, yeah, I think this is a great spot to put it in.

John Hamilton: I think the Reorganization Plan at 3.1.4 addresses this broadly where it says, “approval by the Common Council of acts of subordinate agencies.” It says, “to the extent, even if State law authorizes a board or commission to levy taxies, establish fees, incur new indebtedness, the intent of this Plan to invoke the act to require approval by the Metro Council of any of those acts.” It’s, you know, I think you’ve discussed this 3.1.4. That’s where it’s covered.

President Winnecke: So, your interpretation is the process would remain the same as it is today?

John Hamilton: Yes, and it might even require more than it is, as long as, even if it doesn’t say that specifically, if you’ve got one board where it’s not set up that way and they are going to levy taxes, establish fees or incur new indebtedness, this says they have to come to the Metro Council.

Councilmember McGinn: What was the first phrase you said before? Levy taxes, establish fees and, what was the first one?

Councilmember McGinn: Okay, well, that’s just new. I mean, that still doesn’t fill in the gap of, you know, it’s like the Redevelopment Commission, you know, the budget that we, it might say $1.2 million for acquisition of property. We don’t know what specific property, because they don’t.

Councilmember McGinn: Well, I think what the Metro Council wants and what we’re talking about is we want, besides approving a budget, which is just kind of these generic lump sums, we want to be able to approve specific line items within that budget as they spend it. Do you know what I mean?

Councilman John: Dan, I don’t mean to correct you, but I would like to kind of give it a little clarity.

Councilman John: The majority of dollars, if not all of them, when they’re presented to us at budget time, we have the CIP, our Capital Improvement Plan that delineates any capital projects that’s coming out of contractual service accounts, plus we have the list of contractual service accounts in each department that matches up with the dollars we’re appropriating. So, with few exceptions there may be some in there that’s not dedicated to a particular project that we’re made aware of, but most of them are either in the CIP or in the recap of the contractual services.

Councilmember McGinn: Again, but it’s the ones that aren’t in there, and there aren’t, I agree, there aren’t many, but those are the ones that I would like the Metro to at least get a chance to look at those and approve those.

Councilman John: Well, anytime there’s a request for dollars, you can request that it be broken out to exactly what are we going to spend this for before you appropriate it.

Councilmember McGinn: Yeah, but there are some instances with, they don’t know what it’s going to be spent on. You know, you don’t know what properties are going to come up. I’m talking about Redevelopment.

Councilmember McGinn: Sometimes they just don’t know, you know. I guess, I want the Metro Council to have a second look when they’re delineated. But, I agree, most of it is itemized, but those that aren’t, I don’t want those to slip through the cracks.

Councilman John: I just didn’t want anybody to get the wrong impression that we appropriate millions of dollars and have no idea what it’s going to be spent on.

Councilmember McGinn: Oh, no, no, no. Well, I apologize if I gave that impression. No, I couldn’t sleep at night if we did that.

Councilmember Adams: Well, let me bounce something off you. Let’s say that they wanted to spend, who knows, $17 million on new softball fields, or something weird like that. Would they have to come to the Council, the County Council for approval of that?

Councilmember Adams: Okay, do we have, are we talking about the same thing now on the Metro Council having the same authority?

President Winnecke: The only question, I think that remains with the CVB is the make up or composition of the board.

Commissioner Abell: I like four Council, three Mayor, if the Parks Department is going to have just the opposite, because if they wanted to do a $17 million park, baseball field and the Parks Board wanted to do it, it would be CVB has different composition of appointees to the board.

President Winnecke: I think the only question is do we have the legal authority to make the composition (Inaudible. Microphone not on.)?

John Hamilton: Right, and if you determine what your wishes are, we’ll get that answer for you. If you can’t do it, we’ll let you know.

President Winnecke: So, is there a feeling that this would be a seven member body with four appointments by the Council and three by the Mayor? (Inaudible. Microphone not on.).

President Winnecke: Let’s take a (Inaudible) of that first. Is everybody clear? The vote is seven appointments, four by the Council and three by the Mayor. Everybody in favor raise their hand.

President Watts: (Inaudible. Microphone not on.) If it’s something that we can’t do.

(The straw vote was approved by County Council 9-0 and County Commissioners 3-0.)

President Winnecke: On the next page we have a number of, I guess, actually number 19, the first one under (Inaudible. Microphone not on), Economic Development Loan Committee.

Councilmember McGinn: Is this from the Bond Bank? Is that what we’re talking about? Is that the source of this funding? Does anyone know?

John Hamilton: I remember the current Council adopted this ordinance, and it was to transfer some funds that were in the former Economic Development Loan Account into this Community Revitalization Fund Account. I can’t remember whether there was a reason for the grants or the funding or that it was–

Councilmember McGinn: I don’t remember either. I remember there was a lot of discussion on it though.

Councilmember Robinson: I’m not even sure if that committee is still in existence.

Commissioner Melcher: Well, if they transferred the money out, you don’t need that committee.

Councilmember Robinson: Well, I think, yeah, and I think it’s a plan to do something with the money, if there is money in there, you know, I was telling you about a loan, a micro loan program. I think what the EDA, the EDA loan program with, I guess, Greg Wathen and them.

John Hamilton: The ordinance shows it was adopted in 2009 and it did away with the, I think the Economic Development–

Councilmember McGinn: –and then the funds were to only be loaned to businesses, repaid to that account and then re-loaned. It was sort of a revolving fund, but there wasn’t a lot of money in it. $92,000 for some reason–

Councilmember Robinson: You would probably want to check with the DMD Director, because I don’t even think that money, there’s anything in there, and that committee is even in existence any longer.

Councilmember McGinn: Yeah, I do. On number 22, which is the Evansville Bond Bank Board of Directors. This is, the Evansville Bond Bank is a separate legal entity set up by Indiana statute. Does the Mayor have to do all five of those, John? Is this, again, what this means?

Councilman John: Number 21 it says, five Mayor, four Commissioner appointments, under the Reorganization Plan. Do they mean Common Council? Because there will no longer be Commissioners if this–

Commissioner Melcher: I think what you’re getting at where they said the attorneys are saying is it’s all executive appointments, over here, according to the statute.

John Hamilton: In the actual Reorganization Plan the exhibit I’m reading does say five Mayor and four Council. So, maybe that is a typo. So, that’s just a typo on our end.

Commissioner Melcher: You know, the Drainage Board now is the three Commissioners, and then the Surveyor is part of it. Is the Surveyor still going to be part of it?

President Winnecke: I think the statute requires the Surveyor serves at the technical advisor to the Drainage Board.

Commissioner Melcher: Well, I’m just saying that’s the best way for it to work. If you take the Surveyor completely out, and I would like to talk to Jeffers a little bit about that, because I think he might have his own ideas too.

Commissioner Abell: I have a little problem with the Drainage Board not having elected people on it, because the people who have a problem with their drainage issues come before the Drainage Board to try to work those issues out. I think they’re entitled to stand before a body that they elect and not before a group of appointed people.

President Winnecke: John, could you look to see if those could be, those appointments could be members of the Metro Council?

Commissioner Melcher: We’re having a lot of people this year that are having problems with drainage.

Commissioner Abell: A lot of people for the drainage....yeah, and, you know, you’re hearing their issues with drainage with their neighbors and other problems that they have, and, I think, that requires an elected board to be responsive to them.

President Winnecke: I think that’s a good point, because frequently the Drainage Board meetings last longer than the County Commission meetings.

Commissioner Abell: And it is, for the those of you who are in the city, it is not a fun board to serve on.

Councilmember Adams: For my own edification, how are the Evansville Brownfield Corporation Directors appointed?

Councilmember Robinson: Well, I’m appointed, I’m the City Council representative and I’m appointed by the Mayor.

Councilmember Bredhold: It’s listed in the Plan on page 24. Or actually, I guess that’s their....yeah, it says no change, so page 24 it’s listed under item number 23.

Councilmember Robinson: We have a representative from the Chamber of Commerce, one from private industry, myself, and the DMD Director.

Councilmember Adams: And you basically are buying up properties that are in trouble and trying to resell them and refurbish them?

Commissioner Abell: John, are you going to check on that, if the Drainage Board can be elected people? You’re going to check on that for us?

Commissioner Abell: I know we were skipping around, and I just wanted to make sure of that, okay.

John Hamilton: On the brownfields, to take note, it looks like one of the Mayoral appointments shall be a member of Council.

Councilmember McGinn: Just a question, talking about the Brownfields Corporation, are those meetings, I know it’s a 501C3, are those meetings public, are they open door?

Councilmember Robinson: We have executive session usually 30 minutes before the meeting, but the meeting is open to the public.

Councilmember Bredhold: I’m sorry. I take it that nobody has an issue with all of the appointments to the Historic Preservation being Mayoral? That’s a city ordinance.

Kathryn Schymik: The current ordinance does say it’s Mayor subject to approval of the City Council. (Inaudible. Microphone not on.).

President Winnecke: Okay, next page, by, we have the Evansville Port Authority, the Evansville or the Environmental Protection Agency Board and the Fire Department Merit Commission on this page.

Councilmember Adams: I’m not sure we need a Port Authority. I think it was created when we were playing with the concept of doing a slack-water ports and the Port Authority is allowed to issue bonds, but I think that particular, it’s just not, obviously, not the economic climate for this, at this time. I think a lot of the, I’ve forgotten whether it’s $84,000 or whatever the thing is to maintain the dock and so forth could be taken over by the Parks Board, if they wish to.

Councilmember Adams: No, well, I apologize. It was there, it disappeared, and then it was refurbished, when in 2007?

Commissioner Melcher: The Port Authority don’t have to be on the river though neither. That can be something else somewhere else. I can’t see eliminating it yet, but maybe there’s something we can do.

Councilmember Adams: It’s sure limited in what it’s doing now, Steve. It has been for a number of years.

Commissioner Abell: Does our Port Authority, would they be working with Posey County? Posey County had a project.

Councilmember Adams: Not that I’m aware of. Pretty much on the river, right here.

Councilmember Adams: They do maintain the dock and the LST and so forth, but I think it could be taken over by the Parks Department. Right now, if they want to get something paid, they have to go to the Parks Department to get it approved to have the bids put out.

Commissioner Melcher: I would think that we would want to leave that, and if this thing passes, then let the next one, let them decide on that.

Councilmember Adams: Well, I was on it for two or three years, and I know what the promise was, and that promise has not been fulfilled.

Councilmember Bredhold: I would think, not knowing anything about it either, I would think though as gas increases to become more expensive and scarce that we probably will be able to take more advantage of the transportation and the fact that we’re here on this river. I don’t know, I would think that might be a reason not to eliminate it.

Councilmember Adams: Well, we wanted to get $100K to do a study for the Corps of Engineers to see the possibility for the slack-water port and couldn’t get that money. A whole bunch of money was spent trying to get a big document on whether it would work, it might work, but, you know, we don’t have, the funding is just not there now, either locally or regionally or federally. Somebody suggested that a slack-water port might go where the bridge across the Ohio for I-69 goes. It would be kind of a....but, again, that’s just a pipe dream at this juncture.

Councilmember Adams: Sounds to me like there’s a consensus to leave it in, which is fine. I just wanted to make people aware of–

President Winnecke: Okay, we can circle back then at another day. Any other questions on this page?

Commissioner Melcher: This is one that I always have felt like the Council should have at least some appointments on. It shouldn’t all be the Mayor, but I understand this is State statute. So, there’s probably nothing that we can do. I just wanted to get that on tape.

John Hamilton: The statute is very clear, the executive shall appoint seven persons, and it determines who they shall be and certain qualifications.

Commissioner Melcher: I’ve tried that. It doesn’t work, but we’ll continue to try though.

President Winnecke: Okay, moving on, just two on this page that have local authority; the Haynie’s Corner Advisory Board and the Human Relations Commission.

Commissioner Abell: Except I have a question about the Growth Alliance for Greater Evansville. It says per their article of incorporation, but their articles of incorporation must say that we have County Commissioner on it, because I’m on it. So, that goes all to the Mayor, is that the way that–

President Winnecke: No, I read that as being that the composition of that board would remain as the articles of incorporation, which requires a member of the City Council, the Mayor, a member of the County Council and a member of the County Commission.

Commissioner Abell: But, none of those groups are going to be here if we have reorganized government.

Commissioner Abell: So, it’s going to be up to them then to amend their by-laws. So, we have no say whatsoever as to whether it’s going to be here or not?

President Winnecke: – of the organization, I think we would have some leverage.

Commissioner Abell: That’s the kicker is that it’s an expensive route to keep going.

President Winnecke: So, to that extent I think we would want a, you know, we could say, we could....what, Dan?

Commissioner Melcher: I mean, the Mayor would bet two and the Council would get two.

Councilmember McGinn: My question was, you said Council appoints, that’s County Council now appoints a member, not city, is that correct?

Commissioner Melcher: The city appoints one and the County Council appoints one, the Mayor and the Commissioners. So, that’s two to two.

President Watts: Well, that won’t be in the Plan, right? This is going to be a recommendation that we are going to pass on to GAGE–

President Watts: –that if this happens, this is what we would like to see you amend your by-laws to.

President Winnecke: Yeah, I can’t imagine there would be a problem with anything that we would recommend. So, what are we recommending.

President Winnecke: No, I think it’s a good question. We should pass it along to the Growth Alliance, if this changes. So, two Council....okay.

Commissioner Melcher: And, this is another one that I would recommend them getting someone from the City Council on.

President Winnecke: Haynie’s Corner Advisory Board, or Human Relations Commission?

Councilmember Bredhold: Are there any members of the City Council who sit on that Haynie’s Corner Advisory Board? Does anybody...the last that I’d heard it doesn’t meet, or hasn’t met in quite some time. I don’t know if it’s meant to advise on the Arts District specifically. I assume so, that’s the name of the Arts District, but, I don’t know, maybe it’s something at least DMD should revisit.

Kathryn Schymik: My husband actually is appointed to that board and I don’t know that they’ve ever met or perhaps had one meeting that he was notified of. (Inaudible. Microphone not on.).

President Winnecke: John, would you mind checking maybe with DMD to see what its status is?

Councilmember Bredhold: I don’t think it’s costing, it’s not costing anyone any money.

Councilmember Adams: Right, but there might be people that could serve on other boards that are meeting.

Councilmember Adams: There are a lot of boards here, a lot of people are needed.

John Hamilton: When you don’t address one and the ordinance has “x” number of members and the Reorganization Plan has a different number of members, does that mean you want to stay with the Reorganization Plan as it is?

President Winnecke: Oh, I see, we missed Human Relations Commission, didn’t we?

John Hamilton: For example, that’s an example. There’s 11, there’s 13 now. The Reorganization Plan says 11, and you can go either one. I’m just asking if you take no action what are you wishing. I would say if we take no action we want it to be as it is outlined in the Reorganization Plan.

Commissioner Abell: Is number 37 computer services meetings that met today at 3:30?

President Winnecke: Once we know the final form. It was created, it has 26 members, largely to make sure that each county and city department were fairly represented in issues of technology. This board does not spend money, but certainly approves projects that go to each Council that approves budgetary expenses.

Commissioner Abell: I have sat on that board since 1992, with just a few exception of years, and there is, that’s a board that I really feel if you don’t know a lot about computers you shouldn’t be on, because they talk about stuff that people vote on that have no idea what they’re talking about. They could be talking about putting five wheels on a car and you wouldn’t know because they’re talking about servers and back room stuff. I have a problem with a board that just somebody’s stuck on there because they’re a department head or an elected person, if they don’t know anything about that issue, you know, I think we need to really specify that they, they have to have some understanding of what’s going on there.

Councilmember Friend: Marsha, I’ve talked to Randy Brown about this. You’re absolutely right, when you look down currently, you have people that don’t know anything about IT whatsoever. It would be nice if we would have other people in the community on those boards, like Randy, a very talented young man.

Commissioner Abell: When that board originally was set up, I think his name was Rust, he was at EVSC–

Commissioner Abell: –and he was President of that board at one time, and the Police Chief was Art Gann who was President of that board at one time, both of whom were very, knew a lot about what was going on and understood all of it. Of course, the enterprise has grown so much since ‘92 that, you know, it’s hard to keep up with where it’s going. But, I don’t think we can have controlled growth of that if we don’t know what we’re voting on, and there are people on that board that just vote with the guy next to them because they don’t have any idea what they’re voting on.

Councilmember Adams: So, what would you suggest? (Inaudible. Microphone not on.).

Commissioner Abell: I would really like to see some people from computer technology people in the community on that board.

Councilmember Adams: So, you would suggest people that are being asked to serve on that board have to have that required, just like the CPA we talked about earlier?

Commissioner Abell: You should have to have some knowledge, because you could be voting on the wrong thing and not know it.

Councilmember Adams: John, can we do that? Can we keep the, do you want to divide the board in half and ask the people who apply have to have a means test that they have to have a background in IT?

Councilmember Friend: We spend, that’s a four and a half million dollar a year budget. A lot of money goes through there.

John Hamilton: This is an ordinance. So, it can be changed, but the majority of the members are like County officeholders, or heads of departments. So, you have to decide if you want to keep any of them, or if you want to make these all Metro Council appointments, which, obviously, if the Metro Council is appointing them, they can determine qualifications and backgrounds. So, there’s a number of ways–

President Watts: –for the, I mean, for the department heads, if they have a need to come to this board that’s appointed by the Metro Council that can explain yes, that’s what you need.

Commissioner Abell: I think that would be a great idea. Have the Metro Council appoint every member.

Commissioner Abell: I don’t think you do either. And, you know, I know there’s some people who are going to have hurt feelings if this happens, but that’s what we’re supposed to be doing is–

Councilmember Friend: They should have some certifications on that. I know they’ve got certifications on those, in that field.

President Watts: Well, you can do that via the Metro Council, correct? I mean, because you’re going to be appointing them. You can–

Commissioner Abell: I think the Metro Council could appoint all of them and you should set your own qualifications for who you appoint.

Councilmember Friend: You’ve been on these types of advisory boards, do you have any recommendations?

Councilmember Adams: I would divide it in half. I said 13, but, you know, nine is probably more manageable. I agree.

Councilmember Adams: But, I do think they need to be qualified. I think that has to be sort of in the verbiage.

Councilmember Friend: I would think they would all have to have some type of certification.

Councilmember Bredhold: Are there any department heads here who might explain why, if and why it’s important for them to have a representative from their office on this board? I mean, is this a place where people talk about what they want for their area of the website? Or, what kind of technology they want to use in their offices?

Councilmember Friend: Well, I think what happens, Wendy, they, a lot of them they get together to discuss that, I can’t seem to talk to say the Assessor’s office. My computer can’t communicate with them. Or I can’t download something. It’s about some function, because if I walk down the hallways I’ve talked to different people about how their computer service has been operating. That’s what I get. I can’t seem to talk to another location, to the Treasurer’s office over to the Assessor’s office. It’s by way of the computer that is. Communicating with data.

Councilmember Bredhold: I mean, do you think these meetings serve as an opportunity for information technology to kind of check in with all of these departments?

Councilmember Bredhold: Maybe I’m being too cautious, but I hate to just wipe it away without really fully understanding why all of these department heads are represented, rather than just saying, boy, that looks like a lot of people.

President Watts: Well, I think department heads would still be welcome to attend, they just wouldn’t be a–

Councilmember Friend: You should be allowed to come to the meetings and give their input.

President Winnecke: The other thing the ITAC does is oversee major implementations of new technology in the building. The financial software package that the city and county recently installed.

Commissioner Melcher: We already say Council. So, that’s no. The Mayor doesn’t have any say.

President Winnecke: Do we want to preclude people who sell computer equipment to the enterprise?

President Watts: Well, I don’t know if you would have to preclude them, but I would say that if you are on this board, you’re not allowed to bid work with the city.

Councilmember Friend: Oh, that’s absolutely. You couldn’t, otherwise you would have conflicts.

President Watts: I wouldn’t mind somebody wanting to serve that might say I’ve got more work than I can handle. I think there may be a lot of people that may not want to do business with us, but, I think that if you’re on the board you would not have the option of doing business with us.

President Watts: Did we say all nine appointments are Council? There’s none–

Councilman John: I mean, the Mayor is the Chief Executive of the city having no input (Inaudible. Microphone not on.) very, very important board.

President Watts: I would agree with that. I mean, I don’t mind if it’s five, four, but I agree that there should be some.

Commissioner Abell: I don’t have any problem with that. Is that a motion then, eight to one?

Councilman John: Well, I mean, almost every other board it’s either four to three, or five to four, and sometimes it’s the Council that has the majority of the appointments and sometimes it’s the Mayoral. It doesn’t matter to me which one, but I think it ought to be a little more even between the Council and the Administration.

President Winnecke: That’s what I, what did I say? Five Council, four Mayor. I was writing that actually. Okay, is everybody clear? Nine appointments, five by the Council, four by the Mayor, with qualifications and no vendors. A show of hands on that. Okay, good.

(The straw vote was approved by County Council 9-0 and County Commissioners 3-0.)

President Winnecke: The next page we only have one, the License and Disciplinary Board.

Councilmember Adams: I guess, on number 40 though, I couldn’t understand why now we have seven and the Reorganization Plan wanted to go down to two. Or did I read that wrong? They wanted to get rid of the EVSC. It just didn’t make sense to me. I thought it was good the way it was.

Councilman John: It looks like our counsel has said that according to Indiana statute that it’s a seven member board, three Mayor, one Council and three EVSC.

Councilman John: So, I mean, I would make a motion we comply with the statute if we’re going to have one.

John Hamilton: I thought you had earlier said that on the (Inaudible. Microphone not on.).

Councilmember Adams: I’m talking about 40. I just couldn’t understand why they did it.

President Winnecke: Okay, anything on the License and Disciplinary Board on this page? Okay, hearing none. Moving on.

Page Ten: Boards/Organizations Discussed

Mesker Park Zoo Advisory Board

Minority Business/Women Business Enterprise Utilization Board (MBE/WBE)

Councilmember McGinn: The way, you know, the way this works in practice, the Parks Board can overrule them, though in practice they don’t. So, I mean, there is a check and a balance already built into this situation.

Councilmember McGinn: It’s a very active board. In fact, all of the day-to-day activities are brought there to give some autonomy to the zoo and recognize it as a separate entity from Parks. So, it’s a very, very active board. In fact, the make up in the ordinance, some of the people they are required to be members of the support group also in order to make sure everybody is on the same page. So, it’s a very well thought out and very active group. I’m a strong proponent of it.

Councilmember Adams: I guess, I’m trying to figure out why they have representation of EVSC on the Minority Business/Women Business Enterprise?

Councilmember McGinn: Is that a part of this common, this cooperative buying plan? All three of these groups are together. That would make sense.

President Watts: I think maybe they’re there so they understand the requirements. I want to say that they mirror our requirements, but don’t quote me on that.

John Hamilton: The most recent amendment was 2009. I think it might date back to (Inaudible. Microphone not on.).

John Hamilton: The only one that’s showing (Inaudible. Microphone not on.) 2009 (Inaudible. Microphone not on.).

Councilmember Robinson: I think it was under Mayor Lloyd’s administration (Inaudible. Microphone not on.). Then we amended it in 2009.

Councilmember McGinn: Yeah, could we just check to see if EVSC does mirror our MWBE requirements? If so, then it makes sense. Could we just check on that? If they have the same type of requirements for notifications and opportunity to bid.

Councilmember McGinn: Yeah, if they have a policy that mirrors our MBWB requirements for notification and opportunity to bid. Then it would make sense if they do the same thing, to keep them on the board.

President Winnecke: Okay, anything else on this page? Hearing none. Moving on to the next page.

Councilmember Adams: From our previous discussion, the Public Safety Board would not be compensated?

Councilmember Bredhold: Yeah. Earlier there was a stipend of twenty five bucks per meeting for another board that’s a State statute. I was kind of wondering the same thing there. Yeah, the Housing Authority Board.

John Hamilton: Our understanding is your direction is to eliminate compensation.

President Winnecke: Correct, yeah, and if you can note, if there is a statute that prevents that, if you could let us know that.

President Winnecke: Right. Okay, any other comments here on this page? Hearing none, we’ll move to number 52, which starts with the Board of Works, State statute.

Commissioner Abell: I know it’s by county ordinance that we set up the Public Defender Board, but we get compensated by the State. Is some of the way that we had to set that up, was that governed by the State? Because we do, the Public Defender does get reimbursed by the State for some of the expenses of their offices. I ask that, because I think I would be a little more comfortable, although I’m just one person up here, but if we would change that appointment by the judges to appointment by the Bar Association, or at least the criminal division of the local Bar.

Commissioner Abell: Yes, in lieu of the judges. The judges hear the cases from the Public Defender they help appoint? I just have a problem with that. I would feel a lot better if it was a little further removed.

Kathryn Schymik: We’ll double check. I mean, it’s showing that’s just established by county ordinance.

Kathryn Schymik: So, if it is then you can change the make up (Inaudible. Microphone not on.) by local ordinance, but we’ll confirm that there’s no State statute that (Inaudible. Microphone not on.).

John Hamilton: Then you have to direct what changes you are asking and if there’s a majority–

Councilman John: Now, this is their board. This isn’t, these aren’t the Public Defenders, this is just the board that oversees them. So, they don’t practice, necessarily, criminal law in front of a judge through this board.

Commissioner Abell: But, don’t they hire the Public Defender? Doesn’t that board select the Public Defender?

Kathryn Schymik: The ordinance says the County Public Defender Board is established for the purpose of providing legal representation to indigent defendants.

Commissioner Abell: I do believe that that board hires the Public Defender. I think he’s–

President Winnecke: I didn’t think that. I thought the Chief Public Defender did. I thought that was an administrative function.

Commissioner Abell: I think he’s hired by the board. Mr. Melcher, you serve on that board.

Commissioner Melcher: Yeah, I sit on the board, but I don’t know that answer. He, the one that is there was there when I got on the board. So, I don’t know who, he’s been in there a long time.

Commissioner Abell: He’s been there a long time. I would be interested in knowing if that board...if that board actually hires the Public Defender, and there’s two judges that hire the Public Defender that may practice in front of them, I think that’s a conflict of interest and we should make that change right now.

President Winnecke: So, they’re going to research it before we.....yeah. Okay, moving on, anything, next page.

Page Twelve: Boards/Organizations Discussed

Page Thirteen: Boards/Organizations Discussed

Water and Sewer Utility Commission

Councilmember Adams: The Board of Public Works also (Inaudible. Microphone not on.).

Commissioner Abell: I just think that the Water and Sewer is just, they have so much involvement in the lives of every individual in Vanderburgh County. I would like to see it flipped. I would like to see it two Mayor, three Council.

Councilmember McGinn: I agree with that. This board, by separate statute, they’re allowed to spend money without approval by this Council because it’s a revenue stream, is that correct?

Councilman John: No, I mean, we still have to approve their budget and any additional requests we have to approve. Now, in some of those you’ll see large amounts that aren’t specified–

Councilman John: – for maintenance and other deals. But, no, any money that’s spent there, at some point in time has to go through this Council.

Councilman John: But, it shows in your revenue reports what they expect to get in, and it establishes their budget because of that and we establish the rates to meet the needs.

Councilmember McGinn: But, it’s still one you’re talking about, you mentioned the phrase that I used earlier that there are large amounts, whatever it was, that are really not specified the exact expenditures.

Councilman John: $112, or $120 million this last year and a half or so for the Southeast side drainage project. Yeah, I mean, you know, but we had to approve the bonding and we have to approve the budget.

Councilmember McGinn: But, we didn’t have a choice, any say so in who the engineering firm was, who the design firm was, and, of course, I know it goes to regular bidding, but–

Councilman John: No, I mean, that’s an executive decision. That’s not a legislative decision.

Councilman John: I think too much attention is being paid to give the Council, the legislative body, executive powers. I think we’re getting away from Government 101, you’re going to have an executive branch that does the hiring–

Councilman John: – does the projects, determines what, and then subject to the approval of the Council for funding–

Councilman John: – and that’s where the Council, in addition to passing the laws and doing the zonings, that’s where our responsibilities lie.

Councilmember McGinn: Right. I agree with you, that’s a difficult line. I want to stay out of that line. I recognize they have executive functions, but, you know, the expenditures within the general budget. I mean, I would like this Council to have a little more knowledge and a little more say so on that. I don’t want to talk about any specifics, but, you know, there are times I’m really concerned, kind of like how did that happen?

Councilman John: I would like to see eight engineering firms submit a proposal to the Council and let us select who it’s going to be, because I don’t think anyone would get more than three votes.

Councilman John: You know, so no decision would ever be made. You have to somewhat trust the Mayor.

President Watts: This Mayor is going to be elected by the people just like we are. I mean–

Councilmember McGinn: Board wise though, we’re talking about we can’t...or we can then have some input with the board?

Councilmember Friend: I think, Dan, what you might be talking about....if I may. Sometimes some of the expenditures in the utility went out without any type of quotes. That’s the way it is for services. They don’t have to do quotes.

Councilmember Friend: You’ll find that out. It’s usually an RFQ that goes out, correct? That’s what happens.

Councilmember Friend: Professional services. So, you see a large amount of money, a lot of these projects, the engineering firms will get almost ten percent of the overall project. It’s pretty good size. You don’t see a bidding process per se. Just more of an RFQ process.

Councilmember McGinn: Yeah, well, I mean, if we have some, where we can because it’s city ordinance, we can do a three and two or two and three in this particular instance.

Councilmember Adams: I tell you what, I’m not really worried too much about the Mayor’s power. We’ve got 59 boards and committees here, the lion’s share is going to the Mayor. I just think, you know, every once in a while it would be nice to flip it. It would be nice to give, what we just did for example–

Councilmember Adams: – on the previous page. I don’t see any slipping to the end of orchiectomizing the Mayor or anything like that. From my point of view, I think the three Council, two Mayor is just an attempt for balance.

Councilmember McGinn: Yeah, this is one that, I mean, I would like Council to have more power, this board, than a lot of the other ones. I mean, this is a big money board.

Councilmember Bredhold: I’m not sure why it gives us an either or in this table, under the Reorganization Plan it says either five Mayor or three Mayor, two Council, because the Reorganization Plan just says five Mayor actually. At least the copy I have. Not that we shouldn’t or can’t change it. I’m just curious as to why suddenly there is an option appearing there under the Plan as it stands.

John Hamilton: I do want to make one comment. Even though this is by ordinance, I’ve just reviewed the ordinance and the first section says it’s established pursuant to a State statute. It identifies the statute. So, whatever you do in terms of giving us direction, you may be required to follow the statute. In other words, the ordinance says the Water and Sewer Board is established pursuant to Indiana Code and it gives the statute. We do not have that statute with us. That statute may dictate how the appointments are made. So, I mean, you can give us any direction or changes, but it’s subject to what you’re allowed to do.

Councilmember Adams: If we can’t change it, then there’s no reason why we shouldn’t do three Council and two Mayor. (Inaudible. Microphone not on.).

John Hamilton: Well, I apologize. It didn’t show up on the chart and it does show up there.

Councilmember Adams: You don’t have to apologize. I’m just saying, you know, if you’re going to come back and say we can’t do it, it’s going to be all Mayor, then why not allow the Council to attempt in the interim to have more representation. I think we’re splitting hairs here. I think in terms of comfort, I’m not worried about the Mayor being too weak, I promise you. I think, I would like balance is what I’m looking for.

President Winnecke: Okay, let’s, is there a consensus on the Water and Sewer Utility Commission–

Kathryn Schymik: Sorry. Thank God for iPhones, right? The State statute that enables this says that the board shall consist of either three or five directors as determined by ordinance who shall be appointed by the municipal executive. In the case there are three directors, not more than two may be of the same political party, and then it goes through some of the qualifications. But, so, it’s giving us the authority by ordinance.

Kathryn Schymik: Just the number, who shall be appointed by the municipal executive.

Commissioner Melcher: And, that’s what you guys recommended anyway, five Mayor.

President Winnecke: Last one, EMS Oversight Committee. Any suggested changes here? Okay, this was a good discussion and I’m glad we held this for one evening unto itself.

Overview of Proposed Changes/Direction to Counsel

I believe, and correct me if I’m wrong, I believe we’ve gone through the entire document and made–

President Winnecke: –straw votes and given legal counsel direction on how to modify the proposed Reorganization Plan. We’ve asked the County Surveyor to propose maps based on the districts that we voted on in the straw poll. This is the last scheduled workshop. Our next scheduled meeting is actually–

President Watts: We have the Chief too, correct? Who’s bringing the police jurisdictions.

President Winnecke: Right, we still have to interject the law enforcement language, which we’ll get–

President Watts: We (Inaudible) to take a vote because we were three to three, I think.

Councilmember Adams: And, we also need to talk about, we don’t have to, but we can talk about the information that I sent you all about the equalization of the sewer thing.

Councilmember Friend: I also sent back, because if we don’t do the rate deals, you know I sent to Jim asking what would be the underwriting ramifications by not doing that. You know, if you noticed that we were at 149 percent to revenue, but when you went over to the equalization we went down to 123, then when you put the post pilot in there, it goes down to 107. So, without a rate increase, I’m telling you, you’re going to have underwriting issues on new bonding.

Article Two: Section 2.4: Term Limits

President Winnecke: Okay, article, 2.4 addresses term limits. Thanks for reminding me, we did not reach a consensus on that.

President Watts: I made the motion that there be no term limits, and I would make that same motion.

Commissioner Abell: Are you talking Mayor and Council? Or do we want to do them separate.

President Watts: So, for the Mayor’s office, I would say that there not be term limits.

Councilmember Bredhold: I agree, once again, I feel we, you know, the voters make the term limits. So, I don’t think there should be any term limits set by Council.

Councilmember Adams: I confess, I’ve gone full circle and I compliment Mr. Lloyd’s logic. Circuitous as it was, it convinced me. I think we don’t need term limits.

Commissioner Melcher: Now the Commissioners need to revote, don’t they? We voted for term limits.

President Winnecke: Okay. Second. Okay. This is for no term limits raise your hand. Okay, two to one. So, we have that.

(The County Commissioners approved the straw vote 2 to 1. Commissioner Abell opposed.)

Update on Financial Analysis Presentation

President Winnecke: Okay, so this is how I see this, and, Dr. Adams, I did speak with the County Auditor. He is willing to come and make a public presentation to this joint body once he has a modified plan. He will take that modified plan and compare it to the financial data he’s been provided and give us his guesstimate.

Councilmember Adams: Just out of curiosity, with all of the things that are sort of hanging out there, reports and so forth like that, would it not be willing to us to have yet another meeting in two weeks, or a week, so that if we get all of this information together before we have the final, June 30^th? Because we don’t have to close this on June 30^th.

President Winnecke: Well, here’s what I think we probably ought to do, because it’s going to take the counsel a while, as John’s grimacing–

President Winnecke: But, my thought is, it will, we have nothing scheduled until the 30^th, so we reconvene the public hearing then, but, in fact, we will, hopefully, accept the–

President Winnecke: –all of the loose stuff, with the idea that we’re probably going to have to suspend or continue the public hearing yet again. So, I don’t see any action being taken that night other than this organization receiving data and knowing there may be more data that we still may need. Does that make sense? At this point, anyone from....oh, Steve?

Discussion of Organizational Flow Charts

Commissioner Melcher: I’ve got one more thing. We talked about last time flow charts, and we got a flow chart of 31 pages, but even my tri-focals can’t read some of it. So, I would like to get a blown up one of page seven. If somebody could get it bigger. I even did it in black and white, it was in color, and I still can’t read it all. So, if we could get page seven. Madelyn, if you could–

Commissioner Melcher: We’ll get them to get us a blown up copy. We need to discuss that too a little further.

Councilmember Adams: Was one of those an org chart of the city? Because I couldn’t find one of the city.

Commissioner Melcher: Then one of them had, when we were talking about Transportation, I was trying to find the City Engineer. I haven’t found it yet, unless it’s on this one. So, hopefully, it’s on that one. I’ve got tri-focals and I can’t read it all.

Public Comment

President Winnecke: Anyone from the public that would like to come and address? Just state your name and your address please.

Charles Luecke: My name is Charles Luecke, and I live at 2801 Marcel Court. I addressed the committee, the volunteer committee before about the Levy Authority. I don’t know what the situation is for State statute with the Levy Authority, but I’m concerned that everyone in the county pays taxes to the Levy Authority, but it seems to me only people in the city, or will be in the Urban Tax District after consolidation, will get the benefit from it. I thought that was, I thought it was stark in this past period when we had the flood waters that were up, and people were putting sandbags around their houses outside the city limits and still paying taxes to the Levy Authority, getting no protection from it. So, my question is, is it possible to move the Levy Authority over to the Urban Tax District, out of county, can you do that by statute, and, should it be? Thank you.

President Watts: John, is that something that you can check on? Something else, page 203.

Russ Lloyd, Jr.: Commissioners and Council, appreciate the kind words, Dan. With term limits, I had kind of looked at that, and I kind of thought, yes, it would make sense, it would be a good thing, but the unintended consequences where you see it empowers the people that stay there, whether it’s the bureaucracy, the lobbyists, people that work with government, and you’ve got this, at least in California they’ve seen a constant turnover of elected officials. Even when I was Mayor, at some of the Mayor’s conferences, the California people said, yeah, we’ve got a State Senator running for Mayor, we’ve got a State Rep running for Council, and just kind of a lot of churning and it didn’t turn out quite correct. So, I think you made a good decision on that, and just leave it up to the voters. Thank you for the consideration.

President Winnecke: Anyone else? Okay, we’ll see everyone on the 30^th. Thank you.